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hopperhopper
Jan 23, 2008, 5:39 AM
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I've always heard treacherous warnings, but does it ever actually happen? Has anyone ever seen the rope pull through a backclipped draw?
P.S. I don't plan on trying it.
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miavzero
Jan 23, 2008, 5:54 AM
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Yes, I witnessed a severe injury when I saw a backclipped draw open and allow a climber to deck.
Still, you should not have to witness a highway fatality to recognize that seatbelts are a good idea.
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majid_sabet
Jan 23, 2008, 6:05 AM
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[URL=http://www.imagehosting.com] 
(This post was edited by majid_sabet on Jan 23, 2008, 6:09 AM)
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curt
Jan 23, 2008, 6:53 AM
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dlintz wrote: majid_sabet wrote: 'Nuff said. This thread is done!! d.
Yep--stick a fork in it. It's done.
Curt
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knieveltech
Jan 23, 2008, 7:09 AM
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majid_sabet wrote: [URL=http://www.imagehosting.com] [IMG]http://www.imagehosting.com/out.php/i1529555_Untitled1.jpg[/IMG]
Majid is back!!!
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chossmonkey
Jan 23, 2008, 11:44 AM
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Yes
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epoch
Moderator
Jan 23, 2008, 12:14 PM
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hopperhopper wrote: I've always heard treacherous warnings, but does it ever actually happen? Has anyone ever seen the rope pull through a backclipped draw? P.S. I don't plan on trying it.
Yes
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chilli
Jan 23, 2008, 2:24 PM
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epoch, you turned moderator? sweet.
note to self: no more pissing off epoch. 
majid, that drawing simply explains it all. i see the folly of backclipping so much more clearly now.
to OP: saw some guy a quite while ago with backclipped draw slip the rope right past it. didn't turn to groundfall though. i'd have to agree that i don't need proof. it makes sense that it wouldn't end well, but if i've seen it, i'm sure that there are PLENTY of examples of people suffering for the mistake.
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markc
Jan 23, 2008, 2:58 PM
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Rather than asking us, test it out for yourself. If you're in the gym or at a crag with low first bolts, clip in a draw, backclip the rope, and see how much effort it takes to make the rope unclip when you pull it across the gate.
Chockstone has a series of three photos showing how backclipped draws unclip. I couldn't find you video, but it won't be hard to test yourself.
(This post was edited by markc on Jan 23, 2008, 2:59 PM)
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csproul
Jan 23, 2008, 3:19 PM
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Backclipping may be wrong...but equally as wrong is trying to correct a backclip and putting yourself in a situation where you are more likely to fall while fixing it. So don't do it in the first place, but think about whether it is worth correcting or not.
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markc
Jan 23, 2008, 3:26 PM
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csproul wrote: Backclipping may be wrong...but equally as wrong is trying to correct a backclip and putting yourself in a situation where you are more likely to fall while fixing it. So don't do it in the first place, but think about whether it is worth correcting or not.
If you're able to, you can rotate the lower carabiner over so the basket is at the top. (If you have tight dogbones with keepers, that's going to be a huge PITA.)
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reno
Jan 23, 2008, 3:49 PM
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chilli wrote: epoch, you turned moderator? sweet. note to self: no more pissing off epoch.
Fear his wrath, for he carries the Thunderous Sword of Judgment. 
To the OP: I look at back clipping as a theoretical risk that I can easily mitigate by clipping correctly. Sure, it's possible that a fall when backclipped will not result in injury, but why take an extra chance if you don't need to do so?
I tie a backup knot after the Figure 8 tie in knot. I don't think the Fig 8 will ever pull apart in a fall, but why take unnecessary risk? Same thing, sorta.
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camhead
Jan 23, 2008, 4:21 PM
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I know a guy who backclipped a microfractured biner on an alien, and the whole crag collapsed.
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bigfatrock
Jan 23, 2008, 4:34 PM
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I have never seen anybody climb above their bolt back clipped (not counting myself, I can't see myself climb). I have also never known or heard from anybody getting hurt by this, but I have read a story about a quick draw that "self unclipped" because it was facing in the wrong direction. The rope drag pulled the biner up and caused the gate to press down on the bolt head and open up and when the climber fell the draw popped off the hangar. So the lesson here is always do what is safest.
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onceahardman
Jan 23, 2008, 5:53 PM
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I heard he was tied in with an EDK...
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aerili
Jan 23, 2008, 7:22 PM
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csproul wrote: Backclipping may be wrong...but equally as wrong is trying to correct a backclip and putting yourself in a situation where you are more likely to fall while fixing it. So don't do it in the first place, but think about whether it is worth correcting or not.
Well, if you wanted to correct it, I think the safest thing would be to clip another draw on the same bolt, clip the rope properly through it, then unclip and remove the backclipped draw. If you pumped out and fell while doing this you would always be clipped into at least one piece of pro right by your side.
(BTW, can I use the word "clip" a few more times?)
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majid_sabet
Jan 23, 2008, 7:31 PM
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Is backclipping really that dangerous?
not if you use a locking biner (very rare) but I seen few climbers do it on every 3-4 bolts (protection) as a backup .
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JackAttack
Jan 23, 2008, 7:36 PM
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speaking from experience...yes. On my second lead ever, I backclipped and then fell when one of my handholds broke while trying to clip the next draw. Thankfully the crag I was at had bolts very close together, so I didnt deck. It did turn what would have been about a 12 foot fall into closer to 25 feet. Very scary experience and im definately more careful when clipping now. If I were you I wouldnt even test it an a gym. You would probably be fine and learn a good lesson, but as someone said earlier, you shouldnt have to test something to know its dangerous. I could provide countless examples here, but instead I'll let you think of them yourself.
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csproul
Jan 23, 2008, 7:48 PM
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aerili wrote: csproul wrote: Backclipping may be wrong...but equally as wrong is trying to correct a backclip and putting yourself in a situation where you are more likely to fall while fixing it. So don't do it in the first place, but think about whether it is worth correcting or not. Well, if you wanted to correct it, I think the safest thing would be to clip another draw on the same bolt, clip the rope properly through it, then unclip and remove the backclipped draw. If you pumped out and fell while doing this you would always be clipped into at least one piece of pro right by your side. (BTW, can I use the word "clip" a few more times?)
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markc
Jan 23, 2008, 8:51 PM
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JackAttack wrote: If I were you I wouldnt even test it an a gym...
I should have been more specific when I mentioned testing this. I wouldn't pitch off routes and use myself as a guinea pig. Climb up to a low draw with good clipping holds, backclip the biner, and whip the rope across the gate. Hell, have your friend hold the draw and do it on the ground.
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