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andrewneal
May 3, 2009, 3:08 AM
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I rappelled today by myself using a single fixed line, 2 anchors with webbing using a figure 8 knot to secure pretty much everything. The only belay/descent device I used was a GriGri that the guy at REI recommended. Nobody belayed me, just a friend and myself experimenting. I want to say the descent was roughly 60 meters.
That said.. I need constructive criticism because I felt as if I did several things wrong. I was slightly nervous with nobody belaying me, and only using the GriGri.. it was sort of jerky until I was able to get used to it (forgot gloves, getting used to it wasn't easy). It's sort of like riding a clutch. While I loved the auto locking feature, I miss the freedom you get with a regular ATC device. Are there any ways to self belay on an ATC? I'm considering returning the GriGri to REI and getting an ATC + whatever accessories I need to self belay.. and I have no idea where to start. When I try to talk to the REI reps, I always get a different answer; as if they all have their own personal preference -- which I'm sure they do, but it's not helping me out much.
ANYWAY -- the point of this thread is to just get some advice, hopefully I can get pointed in the right direction.
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socalclimber
May 3, 2009, 3:14 AM
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This simplest way would be to tie a prusik knot above the grigri girth hitched to your harness. You can also just tie back up knots below you. When you start to come close to the knot, pull 10 feet or of rope tie a new back up knot, then untie the that's closest to you. A simple over hand is usually sufficient.
(This post was edited by socalclimber on May 3, 2009, 3:15 AM)
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Becknology
May 3, 2009, 3:16 AM
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You've got loads of options when it comes to backing up a rappel. Do some research on the Prussik hitch. And check out this thread.
http://www.rockclimbing.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=2127346;page=unread#unread
When you rap with a GriGri, you should have the lever completely open with the rope bent over the plate opposite the lever. Of course you can only rap down a single rope with a GriGri.
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andrewneal
May 3, 2009, 3:28 AM
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socalclimber wrote: This simplest way would be to tie a prusik knot above the grigri girth hitched to your harness. You can also just tie back up knots below you. When you start to come close to the knot, pull 10 feet or of rope tie a new back up knot, then untie the that's closest to you. A simple over hand is usually sufficient.
I'm not sure I get what you mean by above the girth of the grigri, could you elaborate on that? I just started rappelling yesterday, literally.
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Becknology
May 3, 2009, 3:35 AM
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socalclimber wrote: This simplest way would be to tie a prusik knot above the grigri girth hitched to your harness. You can also just tie back up knots below you. When you start to come close to the knot, pull 10 feet or of rope tie a new back up knot, then untie the that's closest to you. A simple over hand is usually sufficient.
You can't put a prussik above the GriGri unless you have a third hand to manage it. One hand on the brake end, one hand on the lever of the GriGri, and one hand on the prussik hitch. Won't work. You don't need to back up a GriGri anyway. It's self-locking.
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socalclimber
May 3, 2009, 3:44 AM
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Whoops. Correct, I meant to say he could use an autobloc easily. I don't agree about not backing himself up though. He probably should employ something. Soley relying on his gear and not using his skills (which he clearly doesn't have) is not a good idea.
Thanks for the correction.
(This post was edited by socalclimber on May 3, 2009, 3:45 AM)
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andrewneal
May 3, 2009, 3:48 AM
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My next question then, is whether or not the grigri is practical for descending straight down. As in, off the side of a very tall bridge.
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Becknology
May 3, 2009, 3:53 AM
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Uhhhh... Sure. Conceivably. But that's probably a bad idea.
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socalclimber
May 3, 2009, 4:00 AM
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I'll admit I've done it. I don't recommend it. One thing to consider is that it's probably illegal and would be a great way to get a nice fat ticket if caught.
When I did it about 15 years ago in pasadena, somebody saw me and freaked and called in a suicide attempt. The polic showed up, helicopters etc. Fortunately I made fast time and got out of there before they arrived!
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billl7
May 3, 2009, 4:02 AM
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This thread so far reminds me very much of Edmontonalta's adventures. An example: Made it in to the waterfall.
(This post was edited by billl7 on May 3, 2009, 4:03 AM)
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socalclimber
May 3, 2009, 4:10 AM
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Oh GOD. I totaly forgot about that thread...
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shockabuku
May 3, 2009, 4:53 AM
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Use an ATC and a Petzl Shunt if you want a back-up.
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tready
May 3, 2009, 5:49 AM
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I think the better one was when he was asking about throwing a camera over a cliff to look for a bag.
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bill413
May 3, 2009, 11:52 AM
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I think an ATC is a more versatile device for rappelling than a Grigri. Some reasons are that you can use it on a single rope or double robes; it works with a wider range of diameters of ropes; you can vary the friction in the system fairly easily. (By ATC I mean any of that style of device.)
You can back it up eiter using a prussik knot set on the rope above the device (between the device and the anchor) (old school) or with a friction knot below the device (new school). Or, as mentioned, knots (uggh) or the Shunt.
For very long rappels, gloves would be nice.
Find articles or get someone competent in it to show you how to rig the backups.
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socalclimber
May 3, 2009, 1:41 PM
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No fault in that.
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andrewneal
May 3, 2009, 5:06 PM
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I'm just going to stop making things complicated. Ha. I'll get an ATC device to rappel with, and somebody can use the grigri to belay me from the bottom.
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rockandlice
May 3, 2009, 6:50 PM
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Becknology wrote: You don't need to back up a GriGri anyway. It's self-locking.
Please note that self locking devices, including the Gri Gri, are NOT failsafe. Backing up a rappel device is always a good idea.
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socalclimber
May 3, 2009, 7:15 PM
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rockandlice wrote: Becknology wrote: You don't need to back up a GriGri anyway. It's self-locking. Please note that self locking devices, including the Gri Gri, are NOT failsafe. Backing up a rappel device is always a good idea.
Thank you. Sound advice.
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Becknology
May 3, 2009, 7:52 PM
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No rappel device is fail-safe. But do YOU honestly combine a friction hitch with YOUR GriGri when YOU are rappelling? If not, how then do you back it up?
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socalclimber
May 3, 2009, 9:30 PM
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Well, as I said, an autobloc would work just fine on a grigri. I don't, but I only use mine for aid/walls. But when you consider the number of accidents related to grigri misuse in beginners hands, all bets are off.
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Terry2124
May 3, 2009, 9:42 PM
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For some beginners a grigri is good because you can rappel slow and it will lock if your worried about your feet slipping. Only good for single rope though.
Whatever belay device you use try to back it up, prusik knot as an example.
Atc's are smoother,and you can rappel with 2 ropes. Its all preference, you might want to have one of each.
Forget about using a fig 8 until you get more experience, not as good as atc.
Have fun
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rockandlice
May 3, 2009, 10:07 PM
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Becknology wrote: No rappel device is fail-safe. But do YOU honestly combine a friction hitch with YOUR GriGri when YOU are rappelling? If not, how then do you back it up?
Yes, I use an autoblock which is the most common method.
Edit: Just saw SoCal mentioned the same. I'm in full agreement with him boviously.
(This post was edited by rockandlice on May 3, 2009, 10:25 PM)
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jt512
May 3, 2009, 10:12 PM
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socalclimber wrote: I'll admit I've done it. I don't recommend it. One thing to consider is that it's probably illegal and would be a great way to get a nice fat ticket if caught. When I did it about 15 years ago in pasadena, somebody saw me and freaked and called in a suicide attempt. The polic showed up, helicopters etc. Fortunately I made fast time and got out of there before they arrived!
Don't tell me you rapped off the Colorado Street bridge, did you?
Jay
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On the one hand, I felt like I poured a fair amount of thought into some posts on those threads. On the other hand, I wondered if it all was a troll, or partial troll if there is such a thing. I guess in the end I decided it did not matter since some of the replies (not necessarily mine) might be useful to others. 
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