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mother_sheep
Mar 11, 2004, 3:20 PM
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I could post this in the Warrior Forum but I'll post it here since it pertains to lots of us, I'm sure. Taking practice falls for me is really hard. I'm not scared to fall. I've been doing it a lot lately. I know that I'm safe but just letting go for me is really hard. I always have that moment of hesitation that seems to last forever. It's like my body just doesn't know how to let go. I let my feet go and I'm still hanging on with my arms. I let my arms go and I'm still finding a way to cling with my feet. Is there a certain form to this? Maybe I just need to jump.
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zozo
Mar 11, 2004, 3:44 PM
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I just let go and before my mind knew I was falling I was already easing into a stop. This was a 10 footer or so. My fear of falling has eased unbelievably. We do 5 to 10 practise falls now everytime we go out.
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mother_sheep
Mar 11, 2004, 3:48 PM
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I think I'm thinking too much about it. I just need to get to a safe point and drop without even thinking. That moment of hesitation is what I need to alleviate.
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zozo
Mar 11, 2004, 3:59 PM
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Even though you have a brushwood door,
It hasn’t been shut for a long time;
A few clouds, a few trees
Have been your only companions.
Still I suspect if you stay longer,
People will learn of this spot;
We’ll see you moving
Higher on the mountain.
- Chia Tao (779-843)
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unabonger
Mar 11, 2004, 4:23 PM
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Start your practice falls right at the bolt, really more like a top rope fall or "take" type fall. Further, have your belayer keep you very tight on the first couple.
Then gradually make them a bit longer. The fear of that first "let go" moment starts to go away for most people if the fall is very short. Then you find it easier to let go on the longer ones.
Road blocks are meant to be driven through.
The TakeBonger
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jv
Mar 11, 2004, 4:45 PM
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In reply to: I just let go and before my mind knew I was falling I was already easing into a stop. This was a 10 footer or so. My fear of falling has eased unbelievably. We do 5 to 10 practise falls now everytime we go out.
Five to ten 10-foot practice lead falls every time you go out? So do you buy rope by the spool?
JV
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adventureman
Mar 11, 2004, 6:15 PM
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I'm not big on falling myself...and I have a fear of heights that I'm working through (bad for a climber, I know). But I'm getting better at it, I'm not so afraid to let go if I have to. Comes from trusting your partner, I suppose...and the rope, and your knot, and your harness.... :)
Fear of falling is one of the true primal fears (and yet people skydive...) so anything we can do to work through it is a good thing.
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dirtineye
Mar 11, 2004, 6:39 PM
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Tracy, it was and still is VERY hard for me to let go on purpose LOL. Kind of like jumping out of a perfectly good airplane.
It's unnatural to just let go and fall for no good reason. YOUr body is just telling you, " Hey, what are you doing brain? I'm doing my best to stay on this rodk, and you want me to do WHAT???".
Just DO it. laugh at yourself for not wanting to let go, after all, it is a pretty funny situation.
The first ON PURPOSE fall I ever took was 1 foot. I wanted to see if a very marginal placement that a friend had climbed over woudl have held a fall.
So we set a top belay, in addition to the piece I was going totry to pop. I got ready. Set. NO GO LOL. I sat there foir 5 minutes trying to get myself to elt go for a 1 foot fall with a top backup belay. We all had a good laugh.
Finally I jumped, the piece held, and we moved to a smaller less good piece. Another 5 minutes hahaha. After that one, I tood a 5 footer without too much trouble on thswes really small pieces.
Anyway, I still have trouble pratice falling. The falls that get yo uwhile climbign, even if yo usee em copming a little, are much easier to deal with for me.
So don't feel bad. Or fall badly!
BUT PLEASE do not accidentally train yourself to leave your feet on when your hands come off. That is very bad falling form. You can get flipped upside down that way. Try to get feet off as soon as hands come off, adn go into the relaxred ready position Arno talks about.
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cracklover
Mar 11, 2004, 6:45 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: I just let go and before my mind knew I was falling I was already easing into a stop. This was a 10 footer or so. My fear of falling has eased unbelievably. We do 5 to 10 practise falls now everytime we go out. Five to ten 10-foot practice lead falls every time you go out? So do you buy rope by the spool? JV
So you're trashing the ends of your rope - why? Trying to do bungee jumping on the cheap?
I mean, if you're sport climbing, the falls are going to happen when you push past your limit. Fine. Why practice this? To take away the fear? I totally don't understand this. Sadly, the fear of falling a few feet fades all too quickly just from naturally falling off hard sport climbs when you push yourself anyway. I *prefer* that climbing have an element of fear in it - it helps me push on when appropriate, and reminds me to use rests well.
GO
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dirtineye
Mar 11, 2004, 7:16 PM
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WELL, just how hard are you climbng? Ever fall out of a full on heel hook? Ever have your feet stick in a crack or horizontal but have bad hands and fall?
Yeah this should have been posted in the WW forum.
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jt512
Mar 11, 2004, 7:40 PM
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In reply to: I mean, if you're sport climbing, the falls are going to happen when you push past your limit. Fine. Why practice this?
In order to learn to push past your limit, and climb until you fall. I guess you always do that, and never say "take" or grab a draw.
-Jay
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dirtineye
Mar 11, 2004, 9:34 PM
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It's pointless to talk about tha art of falling to people who don't see any value in it, or who think there is nothing to it.
Arno takes guff all the time from people for being the high priest of falling practice.
Back in my martial arts days, the instructor and I had this little demo where I would run at him and he would throw me up in the air, I'd spin heels over head in a 360, turn 180 as I spun and land on my feet facing him from the other side. That was easy compared to all the ways you can fall in climbing.
When you are coming out from under a roof stretched out dead horizontal with a wall behind you and your foot jammed good, reaching for a hold you hope is there, you'd better know what to do if you fall.
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arnoilgner
Mar 12, 2004, 3:18 AM
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Do it in small steps. Begin on toprope, then at the last pro, then small increments above the last pro. Pay attention to how relaxed you are, if you continue to breathe, and if you grab the rope. If you stay relaxed, breathe continuously, and don't grab the rope then you can move up to the next increment. If you do the opposite then practice more at the same increment. It helps to exhale as you release.
Perhaps this will help.
arno
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micahmcguire
Mar 12, 2004, 3:40 AM
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zozo-you do five to ten 10-foot falls for practice every time you go out? and how many ropes have you gone through? and how many times SHOULD you have replaced your rope? you know, those things can't take that many lead falls without becoming increasingly weakened.
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nthusiastj
Mar 12, 2004, 4:50 AM
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I take "practice" falls in the gym. Not on purpose, but just from climbing. The fear goes away.
Take a couple of falls on the sharp end of some trad. You will never be afraid to fall on a bolt again.
J
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avk
Mar 12, 2004, 5:28 AM
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i'm also afraid of falling. it actually limit my climbing grade. i can follow much harder than i lead. although when i onsighted and (preferably) didn't know the grade, i fell several time and after awhile I wasn't so scared anymore (though not completely). but the next time i went leading, i was afraid of falling again.
i've been planning to practice falling thinking that if i don't it would catch up with me someday, then i'd get hurt. well it happened.....
a handhold broke and i took a lead fall. it would have been a clean fall. my mistake, i tensed up and was just panicking to grab something instead relaxing on the fall. thus, my body was too close to the wall (rock) and my right foot slipped in between the rope that was toward the belayer and the wall. my body was still falling another few feet. so i sprained my ankle pretty bad (some torn in the ligament). took us almost 5 hours to get back to the camp (2 miles hike). doing some butt manteling and aiding to scramble up back to the hike. my good man carried me most of the way and also i also suffled some on a tightly taped ankle (although once the tape was removed the next morning, i wasn't able to put weight on it at all for a week).
i couldn't climb at all for 5 weeks. started going outdoor little by little on the 6th week. still working on streghten it (now going 7 weeks). still have a little bit of swelling, stiff and hurt at certain angle.
in short, i really believe that in a lot of ways i caused the accident by tensing up because i was afraid. and the fall.....was only 7-8 feet. and clean :roll:.
and did i practice falling once i got back? .... er...no... lazy, just want to get back climbing. so don't be stupid like me. i haven't even told you about minor whiplash i got from bouldering because i landed wrong (from tensing up)...duh. weak... i still love bouldering though. trad? never take a fall so i haven't pushed myself to the limit, for the same weak reasons.
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micahmcguire
Mar 12, 2004, 6:10 AM
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you know, being afraid of falling is a good thing. there is such a thing as healthy fear. falling is bad, your subconscious knows it. I say fall as little as possible.
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gumbobob
Mar 12, 2004, 6:21 AM
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there is actually a game that works on the fear of falling--you can do it outside on in--whichever you are more comfortable with--just make sure it is on a well-bolted route with no chance of bad falls...
the climber goes up and climbs until the belayer yells, "Drop!" or something to that sort--the second the belayer yells this, the climber falls, no matter what--just lets go of the rock...this gets you over the fear of runouts...
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drkodos
Mar 12, 2004, 7:13 AM
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If the fall factors are .5 or less, most ropes can handle hundreds of falls, especially if you give them time to "recover" amd tie in on the other end after each fall (but who does that anymore?).
Continual lowering from topropes does more damage than falls.
Ropes do not neccessarily get weaker from taking falls. They loose elasticity, which makes them less dynamic, but not weaker.
Lowering and rappeling are the rope beaters.....not falls.
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slablizard
Mar 12, 2004, 8:06 AM
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In reply to: [ I *prefer* that climbing have an element of fear in it - it helps me push on when appropriate, and reminds me to use rests well. GO
true.
Great one cracklover.
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drrock
Mar 12, 2004, 12:33 PM
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zozo
Mar 12, 2004, 12:48 PM
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Yeah the falls Im talking about are not lead falls, but just top roped stuff and not all are in the 10' range and we dont fall on gear. I might have been unclear on that. I had spoken with M_Sheep about it once before. We have a dedicated rope that has been retired that we practice on. To be honest we havnt done it lately because once that apprehension is gone I dont see the reason to keep doing it.
I think Drkodos is right, this idea that once a rope has been fallen on its toast is a little overblown. In the area where I climb if you fall and DONT have good falling technique you could really hurt yourself so it helps there as well.
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dirtineye
Mar 12, 2004, 1:54 PM
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It's pretty interesting that Arno, 5.12 trad leader, 5.12 FA artist, genuine climbing hardman, and the HIGH PRIEST of practical falling, posts on this thread, and nobody comments on it.
I'm sure many people looked at his post count to decide if what he said was worth listening to.
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swede
Mar 12, 2004, 2:09 PM
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If you have problems letting go - clap your hands. That will give your brain something else to do than thinking about falling.
And as others have said - I hope I never ever gets over fear of falling, because that is what keeps me alive if I can't place good enough pro.
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