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cscooper
May 28, 2002, 9:08 AM
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I ran across this article on what heavy climbers ought to know. I was wondering if there are any other "super-sized" climbers out there and if they have had concerns with this same subject. Also have you had any gear or protection fail? I run about 275.
http://www.safeclimbing.org/Heavy_Climbers_Beware.pdf
[ This Message was edited by: cscooper on 2002-05-28 02:11 ]
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spike_in_milton
May 28, 2002, 1:18 PM
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My climbing partner is quite a bit heftier, and I know we've both thought about this. Never had equipment failure, but we're sticking to toproping for the time being. That'll keep the fall force well within a comfortable confidence zone...
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hunter
May 28, 2002, 2:10 PM
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Petzl's fall simulator takes into account the weight of the climber and calculates the forces involved in a theroetical fall on all the pieces invloved, the rope, the protection, the climber and the belayer.
While I wouldn't put my ife on the line based on the fall calculators results it clearly shows how the factors in a fall change as rope length, weight, fall distance, etc all come into play.
I couldn't figure out a way to create a direct link to the fall calculator but if you go to http://www.petzl.com/petzl/publicActiv?id=ESC the fall calculator is on the menu bar on the left.
Hunter
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mtngypsy
May 28, 2002, 8:03 PM
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Thanks cscooper:
I am 95 kilograms, dry weight, add a rack, pack and full bladder I could easily be in the 114 kilogram range. I do have a pretty good understanding of the forces involved in climbing and the relationship it has to my weight. It is good to see some hard test numbers done in a drop facility though.
The advise given about reducing runout close to belays is great and should be used by everyone not just us mid-fat climbers. One method I use to reduce forces on equipment and anchors is to ensure that belays are somewhat dynamic. I try to climb with partners that understand the value of making the belay dynamic and understand how to do it safely. Increasing dynamics in belay systems was not mentioned in the article but is very useful in keeping the impact forces lower.
Last week I took a thirty foot fall on a small cam placed in a shallow, flaring, and irregular horizontal crack. It was a sudden slip that surprised me, It really scared me to fall on this piece. Fortunately it held or I may not be writing this as the next piece of protection was another twenty feet below the cam. I am convinced the only reason it held was because the belayer jumped when I hit the end of the rope. He was lifted 4 plus feet off his stance, and in doing this dramatically reduced the impact force on me and the cam.
With the large margin of safety in climbing gear I doubt braking ropes, biners, slings, etc is a huge concern in all but the very worst falls. What concerns me more is depending on the placement a piece of pro can become dislodged at forces much lower than the breaking force of its parts. What also concerns me is the forces my body can withstand, even 12 KN sounds to high. A 1950’s military standard set for high risk paratroopers sounds way to high. Luckily I don’t take many falls that would approach this, but when sport climbing I fall a lot and want the impact forces as low as possible. This is because I am concerned about my back, each fall has potential to cause small imperceptible damage to the anatomy of your spinal column and it’s surrounding tissue. Like other athletes worry about their knees climbers need to be concerned with their back.
Thanks again for the info.
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hunter
May 28, 2002, 9:42 PM
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Mtngypsy,
Good point about making belay's somewhat dynamic in nature. From the petzl simulator I got an eye opener on how harsh the gri-gri could be on a 1.7 fall factor when used as a belay compared to some older methods. Of course the other side of the story is that a lot of rope slippage is going to occur with a 1.7 fall factor with a dynamic belay. The fall might not feel so soft if the climber hits the deck before the fall is arrested.
Seeing the actual test numbers provided above and comparing them to the simulation program produced very similar results.
Interesting stuff. Now all I gotta is progress from being a TR gumby to an actual climber.
Of course with a history that includes an l5-S1 disc hernitation and an l4-l5 bulged disc I don't plan on getting into a situation where I face any 1.7 fall factor falls anytime soon!
Hunter
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toobigtoclimb
May 28, 2002, 10:16 PM
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I weigh about 260. I try not to take any big falls. This isn't really a problem because I don't climb that hard anymore.
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phlyfisher
May 28, 2002, 11:09 PM
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Nothin wrong with a fat guy on a little rope. People love to belay me. They get a free ride on every whipper.
Climb on climber
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cragman
May 29, 2002, 2:01 AM
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Well, I love this big climber stuff. I run 220 lbs myself and I just feel the arm fatigue sometimes. No equipment problems however. Hey we should start the FCAA(Fat Climbers Association of America)
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cscooper
May 29, 2002, 7:56 AM
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Thanks for the info guys. I never thought about having the belayer being dynamic. I'm not so much worried about my gear failing but fixed anchors and bolts.
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mtngypsy
May 29, 2002, 4:09 PM
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It's good to see there are a number of large bodied climbers out there. I am starting to like the term Mid-Fat Climbers Assc., like its skiing namesake Mid-Fats are great all rounders. Dosen't sound like any of your are truely fat just way larger than your avarage 18 year old 5.12 sport climber.
When climbing in the mountains, or backcountry skiing a large body can actually be an advantage. Climb on my Mid-Fat bro's.
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