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shakylegs
Aug 19, 2005, 3:48 PM
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In reply to: Yeah and your new slogan could be "Tastes Like Chicken"
Or "MadRock: Just because we're cheaper doesn't mean we're better."
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curt
Aug 19, 2005, 4:40 PM
Post #127 of 169
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deleted double post....
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curt
Aug 19, 2005, 4:41 PM
Post #128 of 169
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In reply to: I have never worn a pair of Mad Rock shoes in my life. In fact, I don't even know if I've ever seen a pair. They sound like a pricepoint kind of shoe that apparently behaves like a pricepoint kind of shoe, so I'll probably stay away from them. What I do find interesting is the people in this thread that were wounded by the OPs "insulting" someone's climbing ability. Near as I can tell, he made fun of someone's footwork. Not their mother or their ethnic heritage or their son who was killed in Iraq. Their climbing footwork! On a website where people are always telling everyone else to STFU and flaming over inconsequential gibberish, it seems rather silly to suddenly develop such thin skin.
A totally valid observation--in my opinion. All this Mad Rock bashing is way over the top, in view of the original "sin" Joe committed here. For all we know Joe's comment was accurate, and even if not, he is hardly the first person around here to suggest that someone's footwork might suck.
Nothing in this thread will have the slightest affect on my purchase of Mad Rock products. I like the Phoenix shoes, and already have another pair, new and in the box, for when my current pair wear out.
Curt
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sevrdhed
Aug 19, 2005, 4:55 PM
Post #129 of 169
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In reply to: 1) Mad Rock Shoes: People who hate: for example: you are buying a pair of $60 shoes(Flash), that are "comprable" to $150 shoes (Anasazi). You get what you pay for. I happen to like the Flash, and the Mugen, and have bought about four pairs of Mad Rock shoes in two years. Yes, they are cheap, and the rubber is not as durable as 5.10 of LaSportiva. But, I almost get two pairs for the price of one. I am well aware that the shoes will wear quickly. But, the rubber is sticky, the shoes perform to my liking, and I don't mind replacing them every 6 months or so. Logic says that there is a reason that these shoes cost half as much as another brand. To buy a cheaper brand, and then b---- about quality (while comparing them to another brand) is rediculous. Its like saying that Kia sucks because it doesn't perform like a Lexus. snip snip BB
I'd just like to answer this... the reason I'm not going to buy Mad Rocks anymore isn't due to the fact that Joe made what looked like just a crappy attempt at a joke about a customer, but because of their issue with durability. My first pair of shoes was a pair of flashes... they were great for me, since they were cheap, and I was a beginner. However, they only lasted me about 3 months. Sure, my footwork sucked, which contributed to that, but the far bigger issue is that the rubber simply wasn't that durable, a fact that many, many people noticed.
Sure, they're cheap, and you get what you pay for. But, I can get a pair of Anasazi's for a little over twice as much, and have them last for 3 or 4 times longer. Why pay for the flashes then, when I can get a better shoe for what ultimately becomes a better value? It simply doesn't make sense.
If I heard reports that their rubber has indeed gotten significantly more durable, then I'd absolutely consider them again, because they are cheap. I still recommend them to beginners, because I think that they make a great beginner shoe, if only because they're inexpensive and allow you to get a feel for what you really want in a serious climbing shoe. But until that happens, I certainly won't be purchasing another pair.
As for the other post that was curious why everyone jumped all over Joe for his comment, I have to admit, it surprised me as well. I personally didn't think it was that mean, and I've seen a lot more nastier things said to people on this site, including I'm sure, by some of the people seemingly most offended by the comment. It seemed to me that Joe was just trying to sort of "Fit in" with the normal RC.com crowd with the comment that he made. However, I do see how this could be viewed as inappropriate, given that he was posting as a representative of the company still when he made the comment.
Steve
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gat
Aug 19, 2005, 4:56 PM
Post #130 of 169
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Finally, a voice of reason from Curt and roambbl.
This whole thread points to a something I am very fond of saying...The amount of ignorance in the world is frightening.
Simple fact - there simply aren't enough intelligent, 'insert other flattering adjective here', hardworking people out there. You will encounter ignorance at every level. Trust me.
If you cry boycott every time you discover the wrongs committed by an executive of a company, you'll soon be forced to live self-sustaining existence as no company will meet your standards of sainthood.
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jelliott
Aug 19, 2005, 5:39 PM
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I hate when people become rational and actually look at a situation. But I stand by my point Buy Evolv and support the local boys.
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squierbypetzl
Moderator
Aug 19, 2005, 6:05 PM
Post #132 of 169
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Agreed, this whole thread is way over the top and for madrock and Mad Rockīs sake I kinda hope it hadnīt gone as far as it did.
So the guy slipped up once (which really wasnīt that big a deal; who hasnīt flamed someone on this site at least once?).
Then he tried to put his mistake behind him, be it in an innappropriate way or not (hiding the thread).
We all started digging into him after that happened, and personally Iīm not sure how Iīd react if I were in his shoes (well, I would have apologized from the start). He kept trying to get over his dumb mistake but ended up just digging his grave even deeper.
And of course, since thatīs the way things go on this site, it gone blown up bigger and bigger with each passing post. Then madrock made a post that gave the impression that site management had something to do with his screw ups... damn.
Seriously, once youīve succesfully dragged Phil(box) and Tim (of all people, theyīre at the top of the food chain around here, dude) into this mess, itīs time to suck it up, make an apology, and wait until this all blows over, hopefully with little repercusion to your employer.
Itīs been fun, but I just kinda want this thread to die (note: kinda).
Note: the site seems to work just fine like it is, but having to track down a thread is a hassle.
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dingus
Aug 19, 2005, 6:08 PM
Post #133 of 169
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In reply to: A totally valid observation--in my opinion. All this Mad Rock bashing is way over the top, in view of the original "sin" Joe committed here.
Typical rc.com prolatariat reaction... OFF WITH HIS HEAD!!!
Some of this crowd is famous for going after people where they work, over the lamest of things.
DMT
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theturtle
Aug 19, 2005, 6:09 PM
Post #134 of 169
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I climb in Mad Rocks and have never noticed any issues with the quality or durability. A pair of Flashes usually lasts me 9 months to a year, and I climb 200 - 250 days a year.
As the manager of a climbing retail store for 6 years the biggest quality issues and returns I noticed were 5.10 shoes.
Fortunately 5.10s don't fit my feet.
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sevrdhed
Aug 19, 2005, 6:31 PM
Post #135 of 169
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In reply to: I climb in Mad Rocks and have never noticed any issues with the quality or durability. A pair of Flashes usually lasts me 9 months to a year, and I climb 200 - 250 days a year. As the manager of a climbing retail store for 6 years the biggest quality issues and returns I noticed were 5.10 shoes. Fortunately 5.10s don't fit my feet.
That's interesting... that's the exact opposite experience I've had, and the first time I've ever heard anyone report that they had better results with durability with Madrock flashes then they have with any 5.10's.
But, my post count is higher, so I must be right! :lol:
Steve
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sa
Aug 19, 2005, 7:50 PM
Post #136 of 169
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Registered: Sep 10, 2004
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Shhhhh. Listen very carefully. Can you hear that?
It's the sound of MadRock laughing at a bunch of whining, wannabe, web-addicted buttholes.
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hosh
Aug 19, 2005, 7:54 PM
Post #137 of 169
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In reply to: Shhhhh. Listen very carefully. Can you hear that? It's the sound of MadRock laughing at a bunch of whining, wannabe, web-addicted buttholes.
wow, really? sounds more like MadRock hiding behind their shame if you ask me...
hosh.
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tim
Aug 19, 2005, 8:22 PM
Post #138 of 169
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nb. I should have mentioned earlier -- I own a pair of Mugens and they work well for their intended purpose (bouldering and sport). I wore out one pair, returned them to REI, and got a replacement (hey, shoes should last more than 3 months in my opinion -- my footwork is decent enough that I usually wear through the spot under the tip of my big toe). What Joe says and does reflects on Joe personally far more than it does on MadRock, or at least that's my impression of the situation. If I were Joe I'd be a lot more concerned about pissing off one of their distribution channels.
Mad Rock will continue to do fine unless someone else comes along and can match them on both price and distribution. Their rubber is softer and stickier so it wears through faster -- simple physics. I happen to agree with Joe that, below about 5.11, it is very hard to tell the difference between different types of sticky rubber. (I have managed to pull down on routes up to 5.12, and lead up to 5.11 sport; not great, but enough to feel the difference in soft and hard shoe rubber) Even then a lot of it comes down to shoe design (I've sure as hell never had a rand tear in my Boreal Spiders, but the things have rands that are 3-5mm thick!). So it's not like Joe told Helpful Poster to go fellate a goat. It did come across badly though.
If Joe was trolling, his first bait (the 5.10 comment) was sharp, but the followup ("mods made me do it") was nothing short of brilliant. Trouble is, it makes Mad Rock look like their marketing rep is hostile to customers.
In the end I don't give a fuck, but stuff that gets posted on here ends up splattered across a lot of eyeballs (about half a million pageviews a day) so if you're representing a company in public, maybe this is a cautionary tale.
Trango does the same thing that MadRock is doing, but with a somewhat less mercurial tone, and it seems to have opened more peoples' eyes to the innovative work that Malcolm bankrolls. Mad Rock innovated, too, in their sourcing and distribution practices; there's no reason why they should pay some PR firm to name their rubber when they can just go ask the target market for ideas. It keeps their shoes' prices down. Pointing out the obvious ("if you're only climbing 5.10 you can't feel the difference in rubbers") is fun but probably counterproductive during this sort of exchange. As pointed out previously, the only difference between this flame and the thousands of others exchanged daily is that it was a marketing rep flaming a customer.
Really, if Fish can manage not to flame his customers, it can't be that hard ;-)
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dingus
Aug 19, 2005, 8:37 PM
Post #139 of 169
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In reply to: Really, if Fish can manage not to flame his customers, it can't be that hard ;-)
He's had his moments too of course. But Fish is a one-of-a-kind and expecting other vendors to be like him is like specting all how-to books to be like largo's!
Nice one, huh?
But the Fish is GOOD.
DMT
funny too
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j_ung
Aug 19, 2005, 8:38 PM
Post #140 of 169
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Registered: Nov 21, 2003
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In reply to: Shhhhh. Listen very carefully. Can you hear that? It's the sound of MadRock laughing at a bunch of whining, wannabe, web-addicted buttholes.
Whether this torrent of responses to Joe's remark is desrved or not is irrelevent. RC.com boasts over 100,000 page views per day and tens of thousands of registered users. It's doubtful that you hear laughter. :|
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saskrock
Aug 19, 2005, 9:38 PM
Post #141 of 169
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Everyone needs to go back and read the 2nd and 3rd posts on page 8. Both points are well made, so take note. On a side note about the rubber Mad rock uses, if you want sticky then you are going to have to sacrifice durablilty, thats the trade off you will have to make and live with. Ex. Look at the new Onyx rubber from 5.10 its sticky and I love it on my new shoes but 4 days on rock and there is much more wear then I would expect on C4. So if you want a sticky performance shoe don't Bi*tch about having to replace them more offen.
Oh and just so there isn't another remark about climbing ability/ footwork I climb well over 5.10.
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memory_hole
Aug 19, 2005, 9:54 PM
Post #142 of 169
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In reply to: Everyone needs to go back and read the 2nd and 3rd posts on page 8. Both points are well made, so take note.
In reply to: On a side note about the rubber Mad rock uses, if you want sticky then you are going to have to sacrifice durablilty, thats the trade off you will have to make and live with. |
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stymingersfink
Aug 19, 2005, 10:50 PM
Post #144 of 169
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In reply to: REFUSR REally f---ing Sticky Rubber Then add what ever the inventory number is to the end. Make it sound cool and s---.
you meant
REally FUcking Shitty Rubber?
but then you get what you pay for. I'm NOT sponsored, so I'd rather spend a few $ more and have something I can actually climb in for more than a couple of weeks.
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madrock
Aug 20, 2005, 2:37 AM
Post #145 of 169
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This is getting really good. :lol:
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madrock
Aug 20, 2005, 2:39 AM
Post #146 of 169
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This could be some kind or record for the most activity of any forum thread.
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madrock
Aug 20, 2005, 3:32 AM
Post #148 of 169
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OK, whats the record. We should go for it. remember we are just getting started.
Joe
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reno
Aug 20, 2005, 4:17 AM
Post #149 of 169
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In reply to: OK, whats the record. We should go for it. remember we are just getting started.
Most Viewed Topic
1. The MASS CLIMBERS thread 352772
2. Women of RC.com 236160
3. Front Range climbing partners - ongoing thread 110864
4. Yet another "name that" game... 73990
5. Ask the NOOB 68135
6. This is important.....John Rosholt? 67865
7. Fatal accident at Tahquitz 10/19/03 61800
8. Hot Deals: Post all of your Hot Deals here 57091
9. "cragchica" Andria's valued life 56470
10. ambition & ego: my 160' fall in zion 43451
Topic with Most Replies
1. The MASS CLIMBERS thread 16050
2. WORD ASSOCIATION: TAKE OFF AND ........GO!!!!!!! 5386
3. Front Range climbing partners - ongoing thread 4181
4. FREE WORD ASSOCIATION!!!!!.......GO!!! 3515
5. The person above you 2864
6. The longest thread! *we can do it!* 1699
7. Yet another "name that" game... 1502
8. Sex with whoM????? 1171
9. The Person Below me 1028
10. Jono's Bar 989
Currently, this thread has 8910 views with 146 replies.
Well, 147 now.
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madrock
Aug 20, 2005, 4:21 AM
Post #150 of 169
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OK how about the record for views??? I know the topic is not interesting enough for that many comments.
Joe
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