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karmiclimber
Apr 30, 2012, 11:01 AM
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So while I was reading in the routes database and putting together a hitlist, I noticed that someone logged an ascent of a TR as an onsight. The climb is top rope only. I thought onsight only applied to lead or trad...that toproping was just toproping.
**Please note I'm not trying to call anyone out...I'm just trying to figure out if I'm wrong and you can onsight a TR. Ty.
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sungam
Apr 30, 2012, 11:35 AM
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Meh, if it's a TR only route (such as on southern sandstone in the UK) then the style is TR. First time no beta = onsite.
If the route is usually led on bolts/gear then a TR wouldn't really be an onsite, though personally I wouldn't be too worried if someone used the term to convey that they sent it first go.
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lena_chita
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Apr 30, 2012, 12:00 PM
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sungam wrote: Meh, if it's a TR only route (such as on southern sandstone in the UK) then the style is TR. First time no beta = onsite. If the route is usually led on bolts/gear then a TR wouldn't really be an onsite, though personally I wouldn't be too worried if someone used the term to convey that they sent it first go.
+1
If I know nothing about the route in question, and someone tells me that he/she onsighted the route, with no other details, I would assume that the person is talking about onsighting it on lead.
But I have no problem with someone saying that they "onsighted the route on TR". Everyone who knows anything about climbing would understand what it means: climbed clean on first go, without beta, on toprope. End of story.
Between friends, we have a silly term for it: "tronsight"
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USnavy
Apr 30, 2012, 12:01 PM
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karmiclimber wrote: So while I was reading in the routes database and putting together a hitlist, I noticed that someone logged an ascent of a TR as an onsight. The climb is top rope only. I thought onsight only applied to lead or trad...that toproping was just toproping. **Please note I'm not trying to call anyone out...I'm just trying to figure out if I'm wrong and you can onsight a TR. Ty.
(This post was edited by USnavy on Apr 30, 2012, 12:04 PM)
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guangzhou
Apr 30, 2012, 12:44 PM
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USnavy wrote: karmiclimber wrote: So while I was reading in the routes database and putting together a hitlist, I noticed that someone logged an ascent of a TR as an onsight. The climb is top rope only. I thought onsight only applied to lead or trad...that toproping was just toproping. **Please note I'm not trying to call anyone out...I'm just trying to figure out if I'm wrong and you can onsight a TR. Ty. The terms onsight, flash, redpoint, pinkpoint, and hangdog technically only apply to climbs completed on lead. The terms top rope and second apply to climbs completed on TR. But whatever, who cares. He can call it a "TR onsight" if he wants.
Once again, wrong.
pink-point is pretty dead these days for one.
onsite can apply to top-rope route, especially in area where the only way to climb is on TR.
You can also onsight while freesoloing, recommended actually.
Seconding, I guess the second is always on TR, but it does require more work, often removing gear and maybe following traverses.
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karmiclimber
Apr 30, 2012, 1:02 PM
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guangzhou wrote: USnavy wrote: karmiclimber wrote: So while I was reading in the routes database and putting together a hitlist, I noticed that someone logged an ascent of a TR as an onsight. The climb is top rope only. I thought onsight only applied to lead or trad...that toproping was just toproping. **Please note I'm not trying to call anyone out...I'm just trying to figure out if I'm wrong and you can onsight a TR. Ty. The terms onsight, flash, redpoint, pinkpoint, and hangdog technically only apply to climbs completed on lead. The terms top rope and second apply to climbs completed on TR. But whatever, who cares. He can call it a "TR onsight" if he wants. Once again, wrong. pink-point is pretty dead these days for one. onsite can apply to top-rope route, especially in area where the only way to climb is on TR. You can also onsight while freesoloing, recommended actually. Seconding, I guess the second is always on TR, but it does require more work, often removing gear and maybe following traverses.
Makes more sense now...the area in question is a TR only area.
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bearbreeder
Apr 30, 2012, 2:36 PM
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TRON ... top rope on sight ...
i would never call a TR onsight ... but some gym climbers may
the best is when theres young people who TR a leadable climb, fall 3 times and then shout out to their friends "I JUST ONSIGHTED THAT CLIMB!!!"
i view redpoints, flashes and onsights as lead myself ... otherwise ive "onsighed" many a climb
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surfstar
Apr 30, 2012, 3:38 PM
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If you knew enough beta to know about the TR anchors and there is chalk from previous climbers - is it really an onsight?
This is important shit here folks!
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sungam
Apr 30, 2012, 3:54 PM
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bearbreeder wrote: i would never call a TR onsight
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bearbreeder
Apr 30, 2012, 3:56 PM
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never personally ... a climb may only be TR for you today ... but one day someone bold enough may "lead" it ... or solo it 
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bearbreeder
Apr 30, 2012, 4:11 PM
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IMO onsight, flash and redpoint mean something special in the climbing world ... which is why people go gaga over mr ondras onsights of 8c ... his 8b boulder flash
im not a sticker for "ethics" ... but i think if yr going to onsight, flash, redpoint something ... it should be something that means something ... not something you shout out to impress yr friends
TRing takes away the mental aspect of climbing ... ie that of falling on lead ... i dont consider that to be onsight. flash, redpoint ...
when i mention this nicely to some climbers who "onsight" a very leadable climb with their friends shouting out beta ... they arent too impressed
each to his or her own ...
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sungam
Apr 30, 2012, 4:22 PM
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Aye, fair enough dude. Seems to make plenty of sense.
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curt
Apr 30, 2012, 4:48 PM
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bearbreeder wrote: IMO onsight, flash and redpoint mean something special in the climbing world...
"Special," like on the short bus?
Curt
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granite_grrl
Apr 30, 2012, 6:52 PM
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I remember my first few 5.11's fondly. They were at a mainly top roping area, one I had to work out and I got second go, the other I onsighted. The one I onsighted was really special to me. Even though it was on top rope I REALLY had to fight for it. Managing to do it clean onsight was a real eye opener that the elusive 5.11 realm wasn't that far out of reach.
In the end I think I just listed the route as a top rope in my log, but it will always be remembered as an onsight for me.
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tisakson
May 4, 2012, 12:51 AM
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You can call it whatever you want. Who cares? Have fun and climb on!
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gen8787
May 4, 2012, 1:38 AM
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I use two different terms when recording ascents.
1. Onsight - Lead only onsight.
2. Tronsight - Top rope onsight.
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shockabuku
May 4, 2012, 11:23 AM
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guangzhou wrote: ...where the only way to climb is on TR. You can also onsight while freesoloing...
The second statement suggests the first statement is a falsehood - that there exist climbs that can only be TR'ed.
Therefore, ergo, hence I declare your conclusion to be CRAP.
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marc801
May 4, 2012, 2:08 PM
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bearbreeder wrote: im not a sticker for "ethics" ... but i think if yr going to onsight, flash, redpoint something ... it should be something that means something ... not something you shout out to impress yr friends
ethics = how what you do impacts and affects others
style = the manner of the ascent that affects only your ego and how you spray about it.
In this thread we're discussing style, not ethics.
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redlude97
May 4, 2012, 2:17 PM
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Can someone make a shirt that says "I Tronsight 5.9" please 
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Colinhoglund
May 8, 2012, 4:36 AM
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For me the only time 'onsight' can relate to anything else then a clean lead, no falls or beta is in the gym. If I climb a route no falls on tr in the gym I'll call it an onsight as opposed to 'i fell' or 'I got it clean the 2nd go' etc. But that is only with regards to indoor. I didn't onsight unless I lead more than half the pitches, no falls on lead or second, and no beta (beyond perhaps 'bring a 2nd #2' etc).
Otherwise its just a big fat, TR!
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surfstar
May 8, 2012, 5:54 AM
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Colinhoglund wrote: For me the only time 'onsight' can relate to anything else then a clean lead, no falls or beta is in the gym.
Onsight?!? The fucking holds are colored!!! Maybe if you were colorblind I could see this justification.
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Colinhoglund
May 9, 2012, 6:00 AM
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surfstar wrote: Colinhoglund wrote: For me the only time 'onsight' can relate to anything else then a clean lead, no falls or beta is in the gym. Onsight?!? The fucking holds are colored!!! Maybe if you were colorblind I could see this justification.
You clearly take yourself too seriously. Its the gym, its just a poor substitute for the real thing. No argument, outdoor onsights are by far more esteemed.
(ps. even with the holds taped you still have to figure the moves out)
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healyje
May 9, 2012, 9:07 AM
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surfstar wrote: Colinhoglund wrote: For me the only time 'onsight' can relate to anything else then a clean lead, no falls or beta is in the gym. Onsight?!? The fucking holds are colored!!! Maybe if you were colorblind I could see this justification.
Well, I don't know, outside (unless it's an onsight FA) then about 90% of the time you're talking about your basic climb-by-the-dots job and is that really all that different...?
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I dunno...I personally prefer to "follow the rules/ethics." Its not really a game if you are changing the rules all of the time. Thats why I asked, to get a consensus of "the rules." 
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