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bensnyder
Nov 20, 2005, 10:48 PM
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La Zebree is at least 14a, probably 14b. As you said, it is not 14c, but there is no way that is is anywhere close to 8a+ or 13+.
As for akira, its power endurance. 40-50 feet of roof climbing with a good rest at the end, and then 25 feet of (relatively vertical) 5.13 climbing past the lip. Endurance does not decide whether you climb it. Therefor, it is not an endurance route...
And about Dani - as stated before, he could probably eat you if he wanted. He is one of the most respected climbers in the world.
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musicman
Nov 20, 2005, 10:49 PM
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look, i made a link!
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daithi
Nov 20, 2005, 10:54 PM
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In reply to: The hardest routes in the world are most likely Realization because of its lack of good rests
With two repeats by Sylvain Millet and Patxi Usobiaga surely we can find a better contender for the hardest known climb! When Millet sent it his previous best redpoint was 8c+!
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nuts_r_us
Nov 20, 2005, 11:01 PM
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Me. Out of bed Monday morning. 5.19d/V31/B3+.
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ridgeclimber
Nov 20, 2005, 11:35 PM
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In reply to: Mountaineering: some route on K2 whose name esapes me (this might not be the hardest climb in the world physically, but the commitment involved is mindboggling - it is the most deadly mountain in the world)
You are probably thinking of the Magic Line on K2. This is the hardest route on the hardest mountain in the world; go figure. Reinhold Messner took one look at the South Pillar (which he nicknamed "the Magic Line"), called it suicidal, and made an attempt on the Abruzzi Spur instead.
The hardest routes on Jannu are unbelievable, with tough, overhanging aid up to 25000 feet, but that's more big wall climbing than mountaineering, I'd say. My vote still goes with the Magic Line; in terms of the ratio of difficulty to altitude, I'd say it takes the cake: http://www.everestnews2004.com/2004k2/pictures/k2m-C2-C3-OC2.jpg
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grimpiperx
Nov 21, 2005, 1:04 AM
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In reply to: La Zebree is at least 14a, probably 14b. As you said, it is not 14c, but there is no way that is is anywhere close to 8a+ or 13+. As for akira, its power endurance. 40-50 feet of roof climbing with a good rest at the end, and then 25 feet of (relatively vertical) 5.13 climbing past the lip. Endurance does not decide whether you climb it. Therefor, it is not an endurance route... And about Dani - as stated before, he could probably eat you if he wanted. He is one of the most respected climbers in the world.
So what? I have nothing to do with this. The point is that if you knew what you were talking about you would know there is a lot of controversy about the difficulty of his climbs. He is not anywhere close to being respected by everyone. He has claimed tons of routes in the 8c+ through 9b range but only has a handful of confirmed 8c+s, alot less than Graham who hasn't climbed 9b. Another thing is that most of his hard routes are hard over hanging linkup endurance fests, Is Realization overhanging? yes. Is Realization pumpy? yes. Has Dani tried Realization? yes. Has Dani sent Realization? no. It is in his style he sent tons of 8c+s through 9bs in a matter of a few weeks. He should have eaten Realization, also he fell from La Rambla 9a+ literally around 300 times as reported from Desnivel.com. It took Sharma something like 30 tries to get Realization. As for Realization not being cutting edge, Patxi is mad mad strong and Millet is a local. I just think climbs with big no handds rests dont deserve linking grades therefore Akira is a V14 with a hard top out.
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fracture
Nov 21, 2005, 2:16 AM
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In reply to: Trad: 14c (la zebre)
That thing ain't a trad climb.
It was sport-climbed (hangdogging, etc) on pre-placed removable gear.
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subtle
Nov 21, 2005, 7:15 AM
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I guess if we're talking about sport climbs, I would have to vote for Realization, simply because it is the only one of the 5.15a contenders to have been repeated (twice) and not downgraded in any meaningful fashion. Realization has also...probably, but it's difficult to guess at these things...seen the most serious attempts by strong climbers, so the ratio of attempts to sucesses is relatively low.
I must say that the recent explosion in the number of claimed V16 boulder problems and 5.15a or harder sport routes is a little puzzling. Clearly, people are training and climbing harder than ever all across the globe...there is no question of that...but the subjective standard that "It's the hardest thing I've ever done, so it must be a grade harder" is quickly becoming laughable. We're already in the 5.15b/c range, and 5.15a has yet to be verified in more than one place, perhaps not even there.
Then again, I've never had to please a bunch of sponsors, either. Rate your project 5.14c and the collective yawn from the climbing world will be deafening. More likely than not, a van-load of 15 year olds will roll up and start onsighting it...and Dave Graham is looking for a new warm-up before he gets on his project. It's sick, yo...it's like 5.16b.
Allez. Homard.
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azrockclimber
Nov 21, 2005, 5:26 PM
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oh oh ...I know this one!!!
"What is The climb out of bed on monday morning."
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bensnyder
Nov 21, 2005, 8:59 PM
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In reply to: I just think climbs with big no handds rests dont deserve linking grades therefore Akira is a V14 with a hard top out.
The no hands rest comes after 40-50 feet of roof climbing. Besides, do we call a 5.9 slab V0- because the whole thing is full of no hand rests?
I don't know why you are so skeptical of Dani. I get the feeling that you are skeptical of him because "he isn't well known in the US, and therefor can't be any good...". To that, I say he has climbed many of america and europes hardest routes. The reason his new hard routes aren't seeing repeats? They're brutally f'ing hard!
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grimpiperx
Nov 21, 2005, 10:42 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: I just think climbs with big no handds rests dont deserve linking grades therefore Akira is a V14 with a hard top out. The no hands rest comes after 40-50 feet of roof climbing. Besides, do we call a 5.9 slab V0- because the whole thing is full of no hand rests? I don't know why you are so skeptical of Dani. I get the feeling that you are skeptical of him because "he isn't well known in the US, and therefor can't be any good...". To that, I say he has climbed many of america and europes hardest routes. The reason his new hard routes aren't seeing repeats? They're brutally f'ing hard!
Hell I love Thomas Mrazek many people don't know who he is, even less so before his 8c OS. Actaully 5.9 is like V0-, I am just saying if there are no hands rests between sections, you can not make the grade anyhigher because of linking sections if it's V7 into a huge rest into another V7 I do not believe it should be any higher than V7. I doubt Dani Andrada because he has not done any confirmed hard problems and he has gotten his ass handed to him on established routes which he should have destroyed. I love Patxi, because he does routes which everyone knows are hard and has a comp record to match, Dani doesn't even crush at the Petzl Roc Trip comps.
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grimpiperx
Nov 21, 2005, 10:46 PM
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O yea and how many and which of Europes hardest climbs has he done......?
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bensnyder
Nov 22, 2005, 12:10 AM
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In reply to: Actaully 5.9 is like V0-, I am just saying if there are no hands rests between sections, you can not make the grade anyhigher because of linking sections if it's V7 into a huge rest into another V7 I do not believe it should be any higher than V7
I assume what you are saying is that the hardest sequence on a 5.9 might be V0- (probably VB). I agree that a V7 - V7 linkup with a huge rest in between is not worthy of a much larger grade, but I would say it is worthy of some increase because it takes longer than you would think to fully recover; i might give the linkup V7+/V8. Just me...
Anyways - every great climber has had their ass handed to them on occasion. I still stand behind Dani. To get a synopsis of his climbing activity this year, find R&I 143, and turn to pg 22.
One of his latest hard routes (Definicion de Resistencia Democrata 15a) is a link up of two previously established/repeated routes: one is a 14b. the other is a 14c/d. His other uber route of the year (La Novena Enimenda 15a/b) is a link up; a 14c and a 14b seperated by an arbitrary hanging belay. Pretty stiff climbing if you ask me, especially considering he has put up 4 other 14d routes this year alone!
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raymondjeffrey
Nov 22, 2005, 12:15 AM
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The one that you can't redpoint.
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grimpiperx
Nov 22, 2005, 1:31 AM
Post #40 of 48
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In reply to: The one that you can't redpoint.
Why are so many people on this site so stupid. My sport-climbing redpoint ability has nothing to do with mine and bensnyder's arguement. God the number of dumbasses on this site is overwhelming.......
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shortclimber
Dec 1, 2005, 9:03 PM
Post #41 of 48
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Registered: Nov 12, 2005
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In reply to: In reply to: The one that you can't redpoint. Why are so many people on this site so stupid. My sport-climbing redpoint ability has nothing to do with mine and bensnyder's arguement. God the number of dumbasses on this site is overwhelming.......
Why are you so mad at raymondjeffery? he was just replying to the topic. Your argument with bensynder is the one that has nothing to do with the topic.
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required
Dec 2, 2005, 8:35 AM
Post #42 of 48
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In reply to: Probably not the hardest grade-wise, but certainly hard to get up: Northwest Face of the Devils Thumb, in Alaska. 6500 feet of sh***y rock and avalanches. 14 teams have made attempts, 14 teams have failed. None have gone higher than the halfway mark. Oh, and 3 deaths too. Good article in Rock & Ice last year (#132, April 2004). Sounds like fun! Anyone care to join me? :twisted: As for sport climbing, there are numerous 5.15s around the world. Some countries, however, are sort of known as having softer rating standards (Japan, for instance). And without trying offend anyone because of their nationality, a few people in a few countries tend to make somewhat dubious claims on what are still very hard routes. A pair of well-known climbers (I don't remember exactly who, so I won't accidentally blame someone else) apparently "cleaned" Tommy Caldwell's route and happened to enlarge some holds, thereby downgrading it. What were they cleaning it with, a pick axe and sulfuric acid? "Cleaning" a route that wasn't dirty enough to stop a man missing half an index finger just sounds real greasy to me. :evil: PS: Grades don't matter. Having fun does. Of course, it's fun to aim for a higher letter grade or whatever, but keep it in perspective.
They are Sharma@#%^&.....You are Tommy@#%^&.
I tell you what you really want to say...They are Yuji and Francious Legrand!!!
Clean!!!Yes,just clean.
Cleaning Routes hard and carefully is Yuji's habits.
You don't know it because of your ignorance ...poor man.
He do not need to chip hold on any route .....first 5.14b onsight ,numerous 5.14bflash,his 5.15a FA, numerous 5.14a onsight...
Oh,I know you will say that He chipped all his routes and others route.
OK.If you feel comfortable by thinking in this way.
Sharma #@#@#@#@!!!Tommy@#@#@#@#!!!!
Yuji sh*tYuji sh*tYuji sh*tYuji sh*tYuji sh*tYuji sh*t
Legrand sh*tLegrand sh*tLegrand sh*tLegrand sh*tLegrand sh*t
HAPPY???YE!!!Be Happy.
Oh!!MY GOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!! MY GOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!
Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!Tommy's 5.14d can't be downgraded!!!!!!
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required
Dec 2, 2005, 8:51 AM
Post #43 of 48
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----->grimpiperx<------
This girl is one of the biggest stupid here.
He only knows Sharma and Tommy.
What he thinks everyday is that all 5.14and5.15 climbers not live in U*S falling and falling again on Sharma's and Tommy's 5.12 routes.
And their 5.14/5.15 will flash by Sharma GOD and Tommy Uncle.
grimpiperx....HOHOHO...
Confess!!!!!This is what you and your HAHAOHOH friends thnk about.
C!O!N!F!E!S!S!
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tradman
Dec 2, 2005, 11:12 AM
Post #44 of 48
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Registered: Jan 14, 2003
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*sigh*
stop whining.
Chilam Balam and Akira are the hardest sport routes in the world. you can tell because they have the highest numbers. Akira in particular has been tried hundreds of times by some of the world's best climbers, and nobody has come close.
Okay, it's not in the US. That doesn't mean it's soft, it means that I'd bet easily 95% of you have never even seen either of those routes and therefore know nothing more than what number is attached to them.
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tradman
Dec 2, 2005, 11:19 AM
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Oh, and talking of trad routes, there are a number of trad lines in the UK which have been confirmed at uk tech 7b, which is roughly 5.14a or possible french 8b or c. These would be pretty good contenders for the hardest trad lines.
These lines are very, very hard and extremely dangerous, but they do get repeated very occasionally. The 3 repeats of 7a and 7b trad lines that I know of were all done by climbers with confirmed ascents of french 8b/c sport lines, so they are in a fine position to confirm the grade.
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tradman
Dec 2, 2005, 11:26 AM
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For anyone who's interested in mixed climbing, the hardest mixed climb in the world is in Scotland: The Hurting (XI, 11) is in the Cairngorm Mountains, FA by Dave Macleod.
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cornish_retard
Dec 2, 2005, 12:18 PM
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How about Rewind, E10 7a. First 90 ft is overhanging, on suspect rock with no meaningful protection. FA Mark Edwards
http://www.javu.co.uk/Climbing/NewRoutes/WestCornwall.shtml#vellan.
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tradman
Dec 2, 2005, 1:13 PM
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Could be, but it'll need to be repeated and confirmed first.
Equilibrium (E10 7a) at Burbage South has been repeated twice (neil gresham, james pearson) and confirmed, and Tophet Wall (E10 7a) has been repeated (Dave Macleod) but remains uncomfirmed.
I think Adrian Berry's "Blind Vision" (E10 7b) and that Great Arete thing of Steve Dunning's are still the hardest on paper, but from what I've heard, Rewind really is brick and I've not heard anyone dispute the grade!
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