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rwaltermyer
Nov 4, 2002, 4:03 PM
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i'm wondering what everyone finds as the ideal shutter speed to capture that intriging bit on arm/hand blur from a climber without getting too much camera shake.
How do you combat this dilemna? Tripod? What about on a hanging shoot?
Just curious and wanted to learn something new today.....
God Bless
randy
[ This Message was edited by: rwaltermyer on 2002-11-04 08:03 ]
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sauron
Nov 4, 2002, 4:29 PM
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I'm told that anything slower than 1/250 is hard to not notice camera shake, and anything slower than1/60 it's pretty much impossible..
Then again, I've shot iso 400 at 1/30 or slower, and couldn't notice the camera shake..
- d.
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eric
Nov 4, 2002, 4:33 PM
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Depends on the focal length. As you may know, the shutter speed should be about equal to focal length to prevent blurring because of camera shake. So if you're using a 200mm lens, shoot at at least 1/200 second.
But to blur motion, you should be shooting at 1/125 and under (depends on the motion of course). With a lens in the 24-75mm range, you can generally hand-hold to about 1/60 second.
So try something in the 1/60-1/125 second range. If you can find a stable platform, then 1/15-1/30 is interesting. There is no 'ideal' range -- there are too many variables.
You can use a tripod on a hanging shoot, but I have found it tends to just get in the way.
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krillen
Nov 4, 2002, 4:38 PM
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It depends on the amount of light you have, yourlense and your film. If you want motion blur try metering to get a correct exposure then adjusting your shutter speed down one or two stops. Make sure you adjust your apature to compensate for the shutter speed. You don't want them to undersexposed AND blurry. That take away from your effect.
Tripods are an excellent way of reducing camera shake, but sometimes are a pain in the butt to deal with. I've found you can get a sharp hand-held image around 125 BUT this depends on how still you can hold the camera. Experimentation is the only way to find out for sure.
Roped-in shooting is fun, but akward and can be dangerous. Make sure your primary concern is safety, then not dropping anything (camera ouch!) THEN your shot.
Hope this helps.
Cheers
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eric
Nov 4, 2002, 4:47 PM
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A lot depends on camera holding technique. For starters, you can bring your arms in against your chest and use a wide stance.
I hand-hold to 1/15-1/30 quite regularly, but then I often shoot several frames to increase the chances of getting a good one. And this is at wider angles.
On the rock if you're hanging, you can prop yourself (or even the camera) against the rock and that will greatly increase your stability. If your swinging freely, then blurred motion shots are probably not going to be possible (unless it's your motion.)
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kriso9tails
Nov 4, 2002, 5:10 PM
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What are you enlarging to? Even at 8x10 shooting 1/30 on a 50mm lens (35mm camera) shaking becomes noticealbe. Many people tell me that they can handhold this speed, and sometimes you can pull it off, but when most people tell me that they handheld at a slow speed (for the lens) and claim that the picture is in focus, but it really isn't. Even your pulse can set it off to the best of my knwoledge. A monopod should be enough if you're only shooting a little slower, but there are still limitations to where your monopod is useful (probably not roped in sixty feet up a climb).
For a little blur? How much action are we talking about? If it were a dyno or some other drastic movement you could try panning (which would look pretty cool if it worked). 125 or even 60 catch most climbers cleanly when they are between moves, so if you time it right these shutter speeds should suffice for a medium lens to get some blur on the hand darting for the next hold or a quick clip.
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cyberclimber
Nov 4, 2002, 5:53 PM
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Most of my climbing shots suck, but I am a photographer and I shoot a lot of sports, so I will go ahead and wade in here. For moderate movement blur, I would guess 1/30th to 1/60th to be your best options. Anything faster than 1/125th will freeze all but the fastest motion. I can predictably shoot at 1/30th with a 35mm or wider lens, 1/15th if I can brace my upper body against something solid. Anything slower than 1/15th is monopod or tripod time, plus you will be getting facial movement as well and I asume you are wanting the face to be sharp.
If you are using flash fill and your camera has this option, dragging the shutter at 1/30th or slower with a rear curtain sync will give you blur on the action and yet if the flash is putting out a stop or more of light your subject will be sharp and still show the motion behind it. Experiment and have fun with it.
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sauron
Nov 4, 2002, 6:39 PM
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Quote:
Depends on the focal length. As you may know, the shutter speed should be about equal to focal length to prevent blurring because of camera shake. So if you're using a 200mm lens, shoot at at least 1/200 second.
But to blur motion, you should be shooting at 1/125 and under (depends on the motion of course). With a lens in the 24-75mm range, you can generally hand-hold to about 1/60 second.
Khanom, I realised I'd left out this part right after I hit submit, and then got dragged off to do work (gee, working at work - what a concept. )
So, yeah.. See what khanom wrote. I've hand-held short focal length lenses at 1/5-1/30 in poor light conditions, with no visible camera shake artifacts..
- d.
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saltspringer
Nov 4, 2002, 9:06 PM
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This shot
http://www.rockclimbing.com/photos.php?Action=ListPhoto&PhotoID=2240
was done from a hanging stance with Velvia (50 ASA) and a 20-35mm lens handheld. From what I remember it was about 1/30 sec wide open at about f4. Play around a bit to see what your own limits are for handheld and use fast lenses. I'm now shooting more and more with Provia 100 & 400 and am getting beautiful results and with smaller aperture opportunities overall picture sharpness is great. Personally, I can handhold my 20-35mm zoom at about 1/10 sec and have enlarged up to 20"x30" from those shots! Just breath out and then release the shutter...
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krillen
Nov 4, 2002, 9:24 PM
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I did this one from a hanging stance as well:
http://www.rockclimbing.com/photos.php?Action=ListPhoto&PhotoID=7604
It was shot at f2.8 or slightly smaller, but I think my shutter speed was at least 125.
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eric
Nov 5, 2002, 1:41 AM
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kriso9tails, sharpness is relative. For some of my work it's critical, but for most climbing shots I'm more than happy to trade some sharpness just to get the shot.
I'd certainly agree that the sharpness of a hand-held 1/30 @ 50mm will, to the very critical eye, be almost always be distinguishable from 1/200 @ 50, but it's not always the most important thing.
saltspringer, that shot is not that sharp in absolute terms, but it may well be acceptably sharp for your application, which is what matters.
Personally, I have quite a few pics that I think are quite ok despite the fact that they are not all that sharp. It would be nice to have both, but climbing photography is hard.
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jbone
Nov 5, 2002, 1:59 AM
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Tripod - Most essential tool after the Camera.
Make sure you have some decent lighting and try to use it for max blur effect..
JBone
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rwaltermyer
Nov 5, 2002, 3:14 AM
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thanks guys....REALLY A GREAT HELP! Its awesome to have such a resource like this at my fingertips. One of these days I'll get picts like you guys...hopefully sooner rather than later!
randy
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krillen
Nov 5, 2002, 2:46 PM
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practice and experimentation are the key. We can explain our opinions till we are blue in the faces but you finding it for yourself will be the TRUEST learing tool.
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kam_ill_eon
Nov 5, 2002, 3:00 PM
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One of the best and cheapest resources for refining your photo taking ability is to buy a photography book. Try a college level textbook or the equivelant. They should have plenty of different situations for many types of photos. Then just keep practicing and you'll develope your own style. Good luck.
David
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eric
Nov 5, 2002, 5:54 PM
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The National Geographic Photography Field Guide is a very handy reference.
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