Don't tell me you rapped off the Colorado Street bridge, did you?

Jay

I'll admit I've done it. I don't recommend it. One thing to consider is that it's probably illegal and would be a great way to get a nice fat ticket if caught.

When I did it about 15 years ago in pasadena, somebody saw me and freaked and called in a suicide attempt. The polic showed up, helicopters etc. Fortunately I made fast time and got out of there before they arrived!

Alright, went down to REI and picked up an ATC. Tried it along w/ the prusik to self belay on a single rope, doubled over to use both slots on the ATC. It worked fine, I actually liked it better. I felt like I was more in control, while on the grigri you had to find that "sweet spot" in order for it to NOT be jerky.. which was a pain, not to mention it made me nervous because I kept jerking the rope. I just tightened the prusik and put my weight on it when I needed to stop and use both hands for some photography. For the record I'm not up against the side of anything.. I'm just coming down off a train trussell about the height of this one. http://image57.webshots.com/557/1/8/93/2582108930100054967tNknhh_ph.jpg

That said, I'm returning the grigri tomorrow and sticking with my single rope, ATC guide, and prusik for self belay. I'm also going to take some advice I saw earlier in this thread and tie backup knots around 10 feet below the rope as a backup and just release them as I get to them. I'm still using 3 anchors as well.

Should I consider a second rope as a safety line?

You should consider finding an experienced partner, reading a few books, and/or taking some lessons from a certified guide. Of course, you'll do none of these, but at least I tried.

Jay

Alright, went down to REI and picked up an ATC. Tried it along w/ the prusik to self belay on a single rope, doubled over to use both slots on the ATC. It worked fine, I actually liked it better. I felt like I was more in control, while on the grigri you had to find that "sweet spot" in order for it to NOT be jerky.. which was a pain, not to mention it made me nervous because I kept jerking the rope. I just tightened the prusik and put my weight on it when I needed to stop and use both hands for some photography. For the record I'm not up against the side of anything.. I'm just coming down off a train trussell about the height of this one. http://image57.webshots.com/557/1/8/93/2582108930100054967tNknhh_ph.jpg

That said, I'm returning the grigri tomorrow and sticking with my single rope, ATC guide, and prusik for self belay. I'm also going to take some advice I saw earlier in this thread and tie backup knots around 10 feet below the rope as a backup and just release them as I get to them. I'm still using 3 anchors as well.

Should I consider a second rope as a safety line? How would that work anyway?

One other thing, I can't decide whether or not I like the prusik above the ATC or below it... any advice on that?

On the other hand, I wondered if it all was a troll,

was that implying I'm doing something wrong?

I've read through a few books in the past day or so.

That was the funniest part of that troll... that anyone wondered.

DMT

Seeking raw beginner advice on the net is the problem. Half the posters on this site right there DO NOT KNOW WHAT THE FUCK THEY ARE TALKING ABOUT.

There is a certain kind of noob, very dangerous. This person has climbed a little, enough to block out the basics anyway. They're read a book or two and may even be cranking som efairly hard routes.

All that is normal in the course of a career eh?

But here's the modern kicker - a lot of these people 'came up through the ranks' of internet climbing forums, where debating and smartassery rule the roost. They pick up all sorts of technical prowess from these threads - a lot of it untested (by them)

Then they offer that same advice up to you as if they dreamt it up themselves, and had tried it exhaustively whilst guiding Everest or some such shit.

There are some very reliable folks here too, who's advice is consistenly good. HThese folks are NOT going to teach you how to rappel on the internet.

The problem is the reliable and the internet warriors can come off sounding the same (cause internet warriors copy them). How do you, as a noob, tell them apart?

Over time you get a sense that jt512 or socalclimber or rgold... these are folks who won't give you bad info or pretend to have done something when they have not.

The simple fact that folks even answered you renders their advice suspect, haha!

DMT

You cant return climbing gear..... anywhere. Used or unused.

Alright, went down to REI and picked up an ATC. Tried it along w/ the prusik to self belay on a single rope, doubled over to use both slots on the ATC. It worked fine, I actually liked it better. I felt like I was more in control, while on the grigri you had to find that "sweet spot" in order for it to NOT be jerky.. which was a pain, not to mention it made me nervous because I kept jerking the rope. I just tightened the prusik and put my weight on it when I needed to stop and use both hands for some photography. For the record I'm not up against the side of anything.. I'm just coming down off a train trussell about the height of this one. http://image57.webshots.com/557/1/8/93/2582108930100054967tNknhh_ph.jpg

That said, I'm returning the grigri tomorrow and sticking with my single rope, ATC guide, and prusik for self belay. I'm also going to take some advice I saw earlier in this thread and tie backup knots around 10 feet below the rope as a backup and just release them as I get to them. I'm still using 3 anchors as well.

Should I consider a second rope as a safety line? How would that work anyway?

One other thing, I can't decide whether or not I like the prusik above the ATC or below it... any advice on that?

I'll just go to the local climbing gym and get some instruction.

maybe you're a troll, i really don't care. i'm going to assume not, and i'm going to assume that you are careful in what you're doing and that you would try stuff close to the ground before you are suspended in air.

look up mule knot. it is useful for tying off a rap (or for that matter, a partner that you are belaying). make sure you put an overhand backup in after tying the muleknot as it can fairly easily be pulled out (that is the benefit of the muleknot, when you untie it, it 'pops' into locked position.

i don't usually use a prussic, but you generally want it below your ATC. if it is above, it can get locked and be difficult to unweight. the problem with it being below is that it can get jammed in the atc--very bad. so some people tie the prussic to their leg loop on their harness rather than their belay loop on their harness, and others extend the atc from the belay loop on their harness with a sling, all of this to keep the prussic from jamming.

also look up 'firemans belay'. if your partner is down from the rap first, s/he can put you on this backup belay method that works like a charm and you don't have to mess around with prussics or the like.

everyone here will tell you you're going to die and you should seek competent instruction. you definitely should seek competent instruction, but myself and many, many others here taught this stuff to ourselves with a combination of books and trials close to the ground. just be careful, triple check everything and (more importantly) triple THINK everything. if you're not absolutely positive it's going to work (you've read about it in competent, well respected books and you've tried it a few times 5 feet off the ground), then don't. fucking. do it.

If you can't stand the heat, stay outa the kitchen! You've gone and showed your hand, now.




100% troll.

Do you think his local climbing gym allows trolls?

all the while getting instruction from the climbing expert at REI.


And here lies one of the problems, potentially. There is no line in the sand that allows someone to be an expert, or even an instructor in this fine portion of the globe. Just say you are a new enthusiast, trained on the internet, with skills untried, and sound confident and you can fool about 75% of the folks. There are probably no "experts" at any REI. The only experts I know are AMGA and I am not aware of any giving away their trade, while working retail.
I do however know some very good climbers whose opinions I value, that instruct and teach climbing, for real money, and in a real college and classroom/outdoor environment. These are closer to expert, and maybe it is their humility, but none classify themselves as experts. Just avid enthusiasts.
And like myself, enjoy conversation about climbing, gear, climbs and the such, but I cannot recall any of us not being able to learn new methods, tricks, or reasons to quite practices we all used to take for granted were "OK".
If you are indeed not a troll, then please take the advice of the wise ones above and seek out a true professional or even an expert. The intardnet is filled up with many people who are self proclaimed experts, believe it or not. To discuss methods and such online leave many openings for bad advice, which by now I should be able to spot easily enough. Maybe not so easy for a new person.
To seek instruction online by a beginner, is entirely another matter. If you wish to take advice given by some of these "experts", then please heed this caution. Who pays the consequences for you believing an almost completely anonymous persons advice. Certainly not what I'm willing to risk.
Find a mentor, friend who knows more, or hire some proper instruction until you earn your salt, then come back here and converse of a passion/sickness that consumes most of your thoughts and has consumed most of your life/time. That would be my best advice on how to rap, single line or double, gri-gri or ATC.
Bob