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mnnewgirl
Feb 27, 2003, 7:37 AM
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Ok, here's a question... How long had you been climbing before you started leading sport routes? I've only been climbing for about a month (3-4 days a week), but am improving quickly and my climbing partners tell me I'm ready. I know all the mechanics, safety, etc. But I get the feeling some people at the gym (Yes, it's the gym for now... Gotta wait till the snow melts to get outside!) disapprove of me starting to lead so quickly? Am I making this up? Should I have more regular top rope experience before I start leading? Help!! :?
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tarzan420
Feb 27, 2003, 7:56 AM
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I had been climbing for about 4 months, mostly in the gym. It's all a question of how comfortable you are with your climbing, and when you have someone available to teach you. Unless it's the owners/employees of the gym that disapprove of your leading, it doesn't really matter. If you want to start leading and feel very comfortable on the rock (or plastic, as the case may be [don't worry, i can't climb outside right now either...]), you should start. Under the guidance of a more experienced climber of course.
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danielb
Feb 27, 2003, 10:13 AM
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I would say its down to the individual. I had been climbing trad outside for only a 1 week course before I did my first lead climb (UK - HS). So just take it easy and start with the well protected and easy routes till you build up your confidence leading. And make sure your climbing partner is experience and can give you support and adivce when you need it.
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dbrayack
Feb 27, 2003, 11:45 AM
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It is all about your comfort zone. You should be fairly solid on 5.10 or 5.9 on TR. What you will want to do is have someone lead it first, hopefully a route that you already know, and then you either TR it, or just pull the rope and clip the draws already clipped, so you don't have to worry about pulling them off your harness and stuff. The technical aspect of sport climbing is easy...clip and go, its the mental that will challenge you. You have to trust your ability. Can you make a hard clip with a potential ground fall? Can you clip really really fast when you are on a pumpy clip? Can you "dead-point" clip a bolt that is out of reach? This is all stuff that you will need how to get good at before you can become an efficient, competitive "to yourself" sport climber. Practice a lot in the gym, get a rope maybe 5 feet long, tie in and either boulder up with clips/ TR, you won't be on the lead rope, but on TR, but you use the lead rope to practice your clips. You will want to be really quick, and solid...practice clipping on shitty biners. Thats what you'll find on a lot of fixed routes: Old stiff biners.
Really its up to you. Just don't hit the ground or a ledge.
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blueeyedclimber
Feb 27, 2003, 1:39 PM
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It doesn't matter, as long as you have someone experienced with you who can teach you. Also, start well below your climbing abilty. My first sport route was a 5.4. Just until you get the technique of it so it becomes automatic. Oh yeah, I was climbing about 4 months before I tried sport.
Josh
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duskerhu
Feb 27, 2003, 1:56 PM
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Hey Sara, I assume you're climbing at VE up there in Duluth ('cus that's the only gym up there eh?).?.?.?...
VE will require a couple things of you before you get "checked-out" to lead and lead belay on their lead walls. I'll get to that in a second but if you think you're ready (mentally and physically) and if your partners think you're ready (physically) then all you have to do is go for it. What's the worst that can happen? You don't make it and try again in a couple weeks right?
Anyway, to get certified to lead at VE they will require you to first, explain the concepts behind a couple things and then show proficiency of the physical tasks of lead climbing...
First, they will ask you to explain the concepts of Back-clipping and Z-clipping and also that you know to not fall with the rope behind your leg and why (which could possibly flip you upside-down)... If you don't know these, do a search of the forums here, or feel free to PM me and I'll give you links or explain them.
Next, you'll need to be able to climb at a level of at least 5.9. I'm not sure about VE Duluth, but VE St. Paul's lead wall has some relatively "juggy" lower end lead routes so, you won't have to worry about a bunch of crimpers on a roof. They usually have a standard line they check leaders out on.
They will want you to climb and clip up to the 5th bolt, then climb to the next bolt (6th) about waist level and fall. They want to know if you can take a safe fall. The easy part of this is (at least at St. Paul) that by the 5th or 6th bolt you're starting to get past vertical pretty well and there really isn't much danger; you're falling into free-air and gently glide to the wall. Just keep your feet out in front of you.
Then they will want you to lead belay. They will have your partner (or another member) climb and clip similar to what you just did and take the fall and you need to safely belay and catch the fall. Points to remember here are to not have too much slack out while you're partner is climbing. Be able to yard out rope when the climber goes to make the clip; not short ropping. Be attentive and watch your climber to guard against an accidental Z or back-clip. And finally, catch the fall without excessive slack.
A little hint I'll tell you now that they would surely mention (but won't cause you to fail) is that they'll be watching to see that you're not standing directly beneath the climber and that you're moving around a bit, watching the clips and keeping a good eye on the climber.
Now assuming you can do all that, you'll be the newest lead climber in your gym... Congratulations!
If they have concerns about your technique or performance in any way, they'll let you know what it is and probably let you and your partner practice on the lead wall a bit and you can take the test again on your next visit.
DO NOT worry about what any other elitest sporto's think about you getting on the lead wall so early in you're climbing life. If you can perform the tasks and have the confidence to do it, then I say GO fer whattcha know!
Anyway, good luck and hope you have success! If you have any more questions, feel free to PM me and I'll see what I can do to give you a hand.
Live Free!
Play Hard!
Climb On!
duskerhu
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climblouisiana
Feb 27, 2003, 2:43 PM
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I bouldered once, then climbed a route on another day. Did my first gear lead the next time I went climbing. If you know how to tie into a rope and set protection/clip bolts then you're ready to lead.
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bishop
Feb 27, 2003, 3:04 PM
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When ever I've been asked this question before I usually say if you can TR a 5.10a with out falling then you're ready.
Now I just say if you're ready in the head then your ready. Simple as that. It makes climbing a whole new sport. You'll never look back and want to TR another route ever again.
Find out at your gym what course they offer and talk with the instructor, they'll have the best advise.
Good luck with it.
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slacker
Feb 27, 2003, 3:42 PM
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About 14 years. :)
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cracklover
Feb 27, 2003, 4:50 PM
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Sport leading in a gym? Sure - if you understand the principles - just do it. I mean next to TRing - this is about as safe as you can get!
To answer your question - I climbed for 2 seasons before I got out on the sharp end. It was another season of only trad leading before I tried a sport climb.
Oh, and this should probably go without saying, but I'll say it anyway - start on the easiest leads possible. For your first 10 leads at least, all you should be thinking about is the process of leading - how far am I from groundfall, clipping efficiency - stuff like that. Once you're more comfortable with that stuff, then start pushing yourself on lead. The last thing you want to feel on your first lead is "uh - oh, I'm totally pumped and I don't think I can make the next clip or downclimb".
GO
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mattheww
Feb 28, 2003, 2:48 AM
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I've only climbed in a gym twice so I have no idea what the requirements are. I started sport leading after only 3-4 outings of toperoping 5.7's on the real stuff. My first lead was at Foster Falls(TN) "Afterburner 5.5" after my experienced parter explained all the safety issues. It was a piece of cake except for the mental aspects. There are plenty of people that never get to the point where they can climb 5.10's that are leading 5.7's and 5.8's every day, so you DON'T have to be a great climber to lead. Right now I fall in the under 5.10 catagory since my best has been a toproped 5.9 at Lieda and a 5.9+ at Sandrock "Jaws". I lead 5.8 routes almost every time I go climbing now, even though I haven't lead a 5.9 to completion. You should start with an easy 5.5-6 to start with and then once you're comfortable, start increasing the difficulty. I almost always try to lead a 5.9 every time I go climbing and have come very close to making it on more than one occasion(had plenty of falls in the process but that's part of it). Learn from an experienced climber and go for it.
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misha
Feb 28, 2003, 3:14 AM
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why do you care what the people at the gym think. it'll be fun to piss them off.
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dig_scott
Feb 28, 2003, 5:26 AM
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i KNOW that i am the exception, but my first lead was my secound climb. somehow i lead a 5.10a. dont ask me how cause i cant do the route now. cant remeber the crux move.
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wanlessrm
Mar 4, 2003, 9:22 PM
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The whole world opens up after you lead! I moved to MT from WI and started leading by teaching myself. I used to back clip sometimes but one day someone came by and told my I was doing it wrong. Get the know how and have someone one check your work and rip it up.
Good luck and if in MT I'll belay for you.
Peace
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cheaterstick
Mar 14, 2003, 4:23 PM
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It took me a year before I started leading. I needed to build up my strength and to bet over my fear of heights (I still have the fear).
I found that I was more worried leading 5.9 sport that 5.10- sport. The way my mind works is that sure 9's have much bigger holds, but those are the same jugs that you'll hit if you fall. Easy 5.10's have smaller holds, but MUCH cleaner falls (usually).
You should lead whenever you feel like it (sport not trad). Just make sure your belayer knows what he's doing and you know how to properly clip, you shouldn't have a problem! Have FUN!! And don't forget that "if you're not flyin' you're not tryin' "
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climbingpride
Mar 15, 2003, 4:01 AM
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I waited a year, well i would have liked to start sooner. I think leading forces you to get better, TR'ing wont.
I'll see what kinda contraversy this stirs up.
Ok, we have a friend that loved it when we took him JUST rappeling. He went out and bought gear for just Rappeling. We were like "Dude! Climbing is where its at!". So the following weekend we took him out on real rock. On the drive out to Queen Creek, he tells us that the only climbing he's done was a short little route at some theme park, and we all know what those are like. So we put him on a 5.6 TR. Next to it was a 5.11c. We both do it. He says he want to give it a try. THIS IS ONLY HIS SECOND CLIMB! AND HE DOES IT PRETTY CLEAN! Not sitting every few inches, but maybe a few sequences of moves. WE throw him on a nother 5.11 and he does it to.THIS IS HIS FIRST DAY! AND ITS REAL ROCK! My partner and i do a few more leads.
Then we come a 5.8 lead that is really fun. My partner and i both take turn's leading it. Then the newguy said that he wanted to try leading. My partner and i were both like um.. Its kinda ONLY your first day! He sounded pretty excited to do it. He had not used the harness pretty much at all in some of the other 5.9's we had done prevously, and this was a closely bolted climb. So we agreed. Talked to him for like 20 min, about falling and backcliping and what not. THEN HE GOES AND DOES IT CLEANLY!! Sure he was a little slow in his clips but that was because it was his first time!. It drove me and my partner crazy. We've got a few others leading easy climbs after a few trips, but not their first. It showed me that the sooner you start leading the better you get quicker. He started at a high level though.
Get out and lead. It is the essence of real climbing.
Ouch kinda long, sorry. :roll:
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jt512
Mar 15, 2003, 4:09 AM
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In reply to: About 14 years. :)
You beat me to the punch with this response.
-Jay
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solo
Mar 17, 2003, 3:57 PM
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If you feel like leading, go for it. It's not a metter of technique and no number of routes on TR will make you prepared to lead. It's a mind game. Try to be concentrated and do not let anxiety influence your actions. Some people are so paralysed by fear of falling that they do not lead at all, or lead waaay ounder their limits.
What I wanted to say is do not top rope just because it's your first season on rocks. Judge your abilities conservatively and go lead.
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mr_phelps
Mar 17, 2003, 10:13 PM
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The easiest way to start sport climbing without dying is to have someone around who has done it a lot, and start on a really easy climb. After that, you'll have a good idea of what you're getting yourself into. The only thing I would really recommend you learn in the gym is how to fall ,as the rock does not flex as much as a plastic wall.
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mreardon
Mar 17, 2003, 10:28 PM
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It's not about ratings or anything else. As soon as you can do a climb without falling, and know the basics about leading/belaying, you're ready to lead. Now get off this board and go do it already! :D
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ricardol
Mar 17, 2003, 10:59 PM
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there is no time equation --
start leading when you feel mentally ready -- make sure you know the basics and the safety required .. then go for it. Start leading beneath your toprope level -- and move up if you feel like it.
.. i started leading about 3 months after i started climbing for reals indoor.. (3-4 days a week) ..
.. i then started leading trad 1 month after i led sport ..
-- ricardo
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ricardol
Mar 17, 2003, 11:00 PM
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are you guys sure he didn't sand bag you -- ?
In reply to: I waited a year, well i would have liked to start sooner. I think leading forces you to get better, TR'ing wont. I'll see what kinda contraversy this stirs up. Ok, we have a friend that loved it when we took him JUST rappeling. He went out and bought gear for just Rappeling. We were like "Dude! Climbing is where its at!". So the following weekend we took him out on real rock. On the drive out to Queen Creek, he tells us that the only climbing he's done was a short little route at some theme park, and we all know what those are like. So we put him on a 5.6 TR. Next to it was a 5.11c. We both do it. He says he want to give it a try. THIS IS ONLY HIS SECOND CLIMB! AND HE DOES IT PRETTY CLEAN! Not sitting every few inches, but maybe a few sequences of moves. WE throw him on a nother 5.11 and he does it to.THIS IS HIS FIRST DAY! AND ITS REAL ROCK! My partner and i do a few more leads. Then we come a 5.8 lead that is really fun. My partner and i both take turn's leading it. Then the newguy said that he wanted to try leading. My partner and i were both like um.. Its kinda ONLY your first day! He sounded pretty excited to do it. He had not used the harness pretty much at all in some of the other 5.9's we had done prevously, and this was a closely bolted climb. So we agreed. Talked to him for like 20 min, about falling and backcliping and what not. THEN HE GOES AND DOES IT CLEANLY!! Sure he was a little slow in his clips but that was because it was his first time!. It drove me and my partner crazy. We've got a few others leading easy climbs after a few trips, but not their first. It showed me that the sooner you start leading the better you get quicker. He started at a high level though. Get out and lead. It is the essence of real climbing. Ouch kinda long, sorry. :roll: |
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lalamur
Mar 24, 2003, 7:19 AM
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i had climbed for about 3 years before i began to lead. like yourself i caught on quickly and knew the fundamentals. i would suggest that before leading you become proficient in top roping, so much that it's like common knowledge and keep good communication with your belayer. i wouldn't really put a specific time period on how long you must have climbed, but just make sure you and your partner/s are ready. good luck,
Dave
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matttheripper
Mar 24, 2003, 7:47 PM
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I did my first sport lead in the gym after a couple months of climbing. My friend showed me the propper clipping techniques and what not to do (ie. back clipping or z clipping) and then I practiced a couple lead climbs on a top rope to get the feel. In the beginning I thought it was harder to belay a leader than to actually lead. It just takes practice and the more you do it the better it gets. I am addicted now and when I go outside leading is all I want to do. Good luck and don't hold back.
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texasclimber
Mar 24, 2003, 8:29 PM
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I started my first day of climbing. It just depends if you are up to it. Go with someone who knows what they are doing.
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