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benpullin
Jun 8, 2004, 11:14 PM
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I was diagnosed with a herniated lumbar disk at L5-S1 where your lumbar spine meets your sacrum as a result of a work injury.
Because of a lack of success with other treatment options, I am facing a microdiscectomy surgery.
Has anyone out there actually had a lower back surgery or know anyone who has? What has been the outcome?
It's hard to find much feedback on the net regarding this surgery except that from MD sites who perform the surgery, and display only positive results.
I am wondering if any climbers out there have any experience with this...
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dlintz
Jun 8, 2004, 11:48 PM
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Been there, done that.
I injured my back weightlifting about 7 years ago. Same deal, L5-S1 disc bulge. After 3 months of physical therapy and not climbing/biking/lifting for 10 months I was feeling a lot better. Then I had a fluke accident while playing with my stepdaughter. The low back pain wasn't too bad but the referral pain down the back of my left leg was excruciating. Within 4 days it had gotten so bad I couldn't even bend over to put my shoes on.
I saw a neurosurgeon after I had my MRI. He told me I could try physical therapy again or go the surgery route (microdiscectomy), I chose surgery.
The surgery was fairly simple and I could have left the hospital the next day but decided not to. My lower back was extremely sore for about 3 weeks but slowly tapered off. The pain down my left leg was completely gone, ahhhh. Seven years later my back still feels pretty good although not 100%. I've had a few scares now and then but nothing that has needed another doctor's visit. Having back surgery when I was 27 was really depressing given my active lifestyle but I'm glad with my decision. Unfortunately my chances of having to do it again for L4-L5 are pretty high since my vertebral discs are fairly degenerated (my doc told me my discs are 10 years older than the rest of me).
The only aspect of climbing that I have to be careful with is bouldering. When jumping/peeling off I have to be very careful to avoid overcompressing the discs.
If you do decide to have the surgery follow your doctor's post op orders. Take it very easy, avoid sitting or lifting more than 8 pounds, and resume physical activity gradually. Good luck to you. If you have any other questions feel free to PM me.
Doug
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benpullin
Jun 8, 2004, 11:56 PM
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I have tried yoga and physical therapy with good results. However, I have continued to work and just get beat up every time I go...
My pain has always been just in my leg and butt (sciatic pain) and rarely in my back, which I've actually heard is a good thing going into surgery... it has a more favorable outcome.
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xclimber
Jun 9, 2004, 12:19 AM
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Well... I'm not a Dr., but I have had intermittent back pain resulting from years of abuse doing construction work, and compression fractures (T-7, T-12, and L-1). When I had a herniated disc in 1983 the Dr. prescribed total bed rest for one month. He suggested that I imagine his face complete with horns and a knife in his hand, and that if I didn't follow his instructions that imagining would become reality... Made a believer out of me.
Despite decades of problems, I've avoided surger, and I am very glad. Many people have experienced negative outcomes from back surgery... No one whom I know that has had it recommends it.
YMMV
X
"You're young and you've got your health. What do you want with a job? - Raising Arizona
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dlintz
Jun 9, 2004, 1:11 PM
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Many people assume that back surgery is simply that...back surgery and don't realize that there are 2 general types: discectomy and fusion.
Small disc bulges or herniations causing impingement upon the spinal column can be treated with microdiscectomy. Only the portion of the intervertebral disc that is pushing on the spinal column is removed. My "knife time" in the OR was 55 minutes. Outcomes for this type of surgery are usually pretty good. There are several pro football players who continue to play after having discectomies.
The particular type of back surgery that has a less optimistic outcome is spinal fusion. Spinal fusions are more complicated (involving incisions in the back and the front). Metal screws and brackets are used to "lock" vertebral bodies together resulting in a loss of flexion and extention at that level. This is usually a last resort for people whose discs are completely degenerated. Persons with vertebral compression fractures often have fusion surgeries due to inadequate alignment of the two vertebral bodies above and below the disc. The misalignment can result in herniation. I've read that spinal fusion surgery has roughly a 30% success rate. I'm a CT Technologist and routinely scan patients as follow-ups to fusion surgery. Based upon what I've seen I'd say the success rate is probably closer to 20%. Even people with good outcomes are rarely pain free.
Of course each person, injury, surgeon, surgery, and rehabilitation is different. If you don't like the information your doctor is giving you get a second or third opinion. Use the internet and do as much research as you can.
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jcshaggy
Jun 9, 2004, 1:39 PM
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I fractured my L1 vertebrate in 2002 when I fell off a balcony. This is in the lower spine. The x-rays showed the fracture was right through.The surgeon luckily didn't operate on me-but i had to wear a brace for three months so I sympathize with anyone who has back problems. He said a lot of exercise would in fact be good for me!I found that climbing stretches my back and I've had less problems.Is this the same for anybody else?
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tsyklon
Jun 22, 2004, 7:14 PM
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Registered: May 20, 2004
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I have the same issue as dlintz.
Matter of fact. I just got an epidural Steroid shot in my lower back yesterday (21st).
The shot wasn't even that painful.
The problem was exactly the same as dlintz. I had no back Pain at all really. Just a LOT of pain in my left leg.
So far with this shot. The pain isn't as Intense.
Also, I am told after 3 days. There shouldn't be a bit of pain in my leg at all.
I will post the results of it in 3 days.
heh
Good Luck with whatever you decide to do benpullin.
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granitegod
Jun 22, 2004, 7:25 PM
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What the heck does this post have to do with climbing accidents?
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cammaniac
Jun 22, 2004, 7:59 PM
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I was in pain for about a year and it got so bad that it hurt to move and I couldn't climb for the last six months. Two doctors 3x-rays and an MRI later, I was diagnosed with a bulging L5-S1 disc. My doctor said surgery or deal with it( shots and such) I am not one for surgery so I started doing my own research on noninvasive therapies.
I came across this decompression therapy called VAX-D. It basically pulls only your lumbar discs apart to alleviate the compression and allow the disc to "Suck" back in on itself. The therapy is 5 days a week for six weeks, and absolutely no lifting bending or extended sitting for that time. I decided to give it a try before any shots or surgery. What can it hurt, right.
Sooo, I finished the therapy about a two month ago. My back didn't hurt near as much, but I had been laying on my back for the last two months so I would hope it didn't hurt. I have been slowly ,under doctors supervision, getting my core strength back. Anyway, I led my first 11a last week and my back feels 90% better. No pain down my legs just local pain around my lumbar, which is getting better the stronger I get.
MY OPINION: Try non-invasive stuff BEFORE you go under the knife, because once you get cut there's no going back.
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jdouble
Jun 22, 2004, 8:53 PM
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Had a microdiscectomy at the end of 2000. It is difficult to give you advice because the injuries are so specific to the individual. In my case the disc was herniated, not bulging, and the pain down my leg got to a point were I was in a wheelchair. Easy choice, wheelchair or surgery.
If you do decide on surgery, heed the recovery advice. My doctor told me I was more likely to injure another disc than the one they shaved down. Either way, study the proper body mecahnics pamphlets at the doctors, I was amazed how much I did wrong.
As far as outcome, I was walking in a few days (woke up after the surgery with the pain in my legs 100% gone). I then babied it for a few months and was back to light surfing/climbing in three months. I would say at one year it was 80%, two years around 90%, now it is almost 100%. The one thing I have noticed is the only time I have pain these days is when I am NOT doing exercise. If I rest for a few days, it gets tight I guess.
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climbs4fun
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Jun 22, 2004, 9:25 PM
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I've had a herniated disk at L5-S1 for 14 years. I've had many different treatments. The one that works the best is the daily use of an excercize ball to do core excercizes on.
I've had success with cortisone epidurals as well.
No way I would do the surgery, but that is my own choice. Most of the time I am relatively pain free and only have radiating pain extremely rarely. I'm very active and there isn't much that I can't physically because of back pain.
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euphoricclimbing
Jun 22, 2004, 9:58 PM
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Hey, hope you can simmer through all the replies and know what to do. I can give you more insight from a therapist perseptive. I work w/ acute and chronic low back patients as a physical therapist asst. I work under four great physical therapist that know what to do. First, surgery is a last option and only a last option. Too many times I've seen eager and over anxious patients persuade the doctor into cutting them. Once a doctor cuts the spinal column, your back will never be the same(100%). Few patients are lucky, as some posted in this discussion, but most do not find the results they had hoped. My best recommendation would be to find a Mckenzie trained physical therapist where you live. They are trained in a new approach to reduced and abolish herniations. They also concentrate on inner core strengthening, but have more insight than the average trained therapist. The longer you wait, the more your chances of reducing the herniation deminish. Look in the phone book and if the "CMT" follows the name, then most likey they have been certified in the discipline. Call and ask the secretaries of the PT practices if needed, but don't be stupid think a diskectomy or surgery is the right way. Any questions reply please, ryan
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