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phxtradrock
Dec 10, 2004, 10:32 PM
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I have a set of Original Wild Country Forged Friends that were handed down to me from my uncle. These things are probably about 20+ years old and haven't been used in over a decade. I have already got a full set of DMM 4CU's, some larger Camalot's, a few tri cams, full set of stoppers and brassies, but I am wondering if it would be worth it to sling these old forged friends with slings or cord to add to my rack. Does anyone still use a set of ORIGINAL Forged Friends? I am not talking about the ones you can buy from Wild Country today. I mean a set that was purchased a longgggg time ago when cams first came to the market. If you still use a set of these I want to hear how they have held up and whether or not you think I should add these to my rack or add them to Marty Karabin's collection. Myfriends need to be lubed up and reslung - Is it worth the money? Or, should I just put the money towards new cams to add to my rack?
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euroford
Dec 10, 2004, 10:38 PM
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on one hand, i'm sure they are fine for what they are, on the other hand they are lightyears behind current cams and your money would probobly be better spent on a couple of more dmm's!
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dingus
Dec 10, 2004, 10:44 PM
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Yes. Inspect them, get them reslung at Yates. Use em as your secondary rack for fixed ropes, top rope anchors and the faint beginnings of a Canyonland rack.
Don't forget to inspect them.
DMT
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davidji
Dec 10, 2004, 10:54 PM
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In reply to: Does anyone still use a set of ORIGINAL Forged Friends? |
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angry
Dec 10, 2004, 11:12 PM
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I would put cordallete on them clean them up and hang them up. They are a killer mantlepiece.
I have no doubts that they are safe as long as you find no cracks or big dings from a long drop. But I'm not hurting for cams, I'd be more interested in them as a sentimental old bastard. I doubt they are collectable though.
Now folks, that comment about cams being "light years" beyond the origanals. I call BS. Holding power, ease of placement in cracks, etc has hardly changed. There are more sizes and colors, and now with flexable stems we can do horizontals. Better? Yes. Light Years? Hardly.
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davidji
Dec 10, 2004, 11:19 PM
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In reply to: Now folks, that comment about cams being "light years" beyond the origanals. I call BS. Holding power, ease of placement in cracks, etc has hardly changed. There are more sizes and colors, and now with flexable stems we can do horizontals. Better? Yes. Light Years? Hardly. |
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lonequail
Dec 10, 2004, 11:20 PM
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I've got a set that is 25 years old and purchased in 1979 directly from Ray Jardine. They are still functional and on my rack when needed, but I prefir the newer cam designs as my primary rack.
They are a robust design and I know of no reason not to use them. They may not be as smooth as more modern gear. Most climbers are not strong on using second hand gear because of the unknown history. If you can't aford new gear then it is prbably OK. If you can aford new gear then relegate them to your desert rack where ## sets are needed.
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maldaly
Dec 10, 2004, 11:23 PM
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I just got rid of all my old rigid friends. They still worked really well, but I figured it was just time. I had an original one that I bought from Ray Jardine in the Valley in the late 70's and gave that to Gary Neptune for his museum. He was psyched. The only functional problem with the really early ones is that the trigger bar is pretty skinny: tug too hard and you'll break it.
Mal
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davidji
Dec 12, 2004, 5:59 PM
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In reply to: One of the old Friends made it onto my rack because it's sooo much lighter than the #3 Camalot that it replaced. The Camalot has some advantages, but not enough to justify the weight.
I was leading a difficult-for-me pitch, and I reached a perfect spot for a #3.5 Friend or #3 Camalot. I went to place the old-school Friend, and the trigger bar had flipped off to the side, rendering it inoperable, until I had two free hands and time to fiddle with it.
I may replace both with a #3 C4 Camalot later on but for now the Camalot is back on my rack, leaving only one old-school Friend (#4).
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ambler
Dec 12, 2004, 7:09 PM
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I still use my set of first-generation Friends, which have seen a lot of cliffs. They work fine, except for a slightly deformed #1 that held a long fall on a shallow 2-cam placement back in '89. I think the rigid-stems tend to have a longer active life than many of the newer cable designs. If you climb in an area with horizontal cracks like New Hampshire or the Gunks, it's worthwhile to add a second tie-off loop through one of the lightening holes.
When I'm climbing with just one set of cams, the old ones stay in the closet. They come along on every trip out to crack country, though. Where you find gear lists like "(4) 2.5, (8) 3, and (3) 3.5 Friends."
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rgold
Dec 12, 2004, 7:40 PM
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I just retired my first-generation Friends to the status of spares when multiple sizes are needed. There is nothing the matter with them and they are just as good (and even better in some cases) then modern gear except for smoothness of action. I thought it was time to join the twenty-first century and have a rack my partners wouldn't look at with a mixture of pity and horror. The newer gear is pleasanter to handle and carry, but otherwise has little or no advantage over the old stuff.
In fact, when it comes to horizontal placements, a tied-off (new or old) rigid stem friend is still strongest pro available, and rigid stem units are way more durable than flexible stems, so the so-called light-year advance is much more one of style rather than substance.
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brutusofwyde
Dec 12, 2004, 7:44 PM
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My old friends are in a box stashed in a remote canyon, awaiting next summer's first ascents.
Brutus
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dr.ed
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Dec 12, 2004, 8:31 PM
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How odd that this thread should pop up now. While putting a rack together for this weekend's outing I realized that my "old" rack was light for the SuperTopo gear recommendations. I have a set of Metolius cams, my big bruiser BD cams (4, 4.5 and 5) about 3 sets of assorted Stoppers and Rocks, Micro-stoppers (they definitely rock!) and DMM offset brassies.. But needed to fill in doubles here and there. The solution was to press into service my old set of Friends, which are probably 15 years old (?).
Usually my partners wouldn't let me take this stuff, volunteering their new racks of Aliens and Camelots instead.
My Friends are in good shape, cleaned and lubed and reslung (the latest reslinging with color coded webbing). I think they are fine.
Modern cams have benefitted from the experience of the last 20 years since the inception of Jardine's. The improvements are nice, but the old stuff will not limit your placements in most cases.
The only thing I would worry about is the problem of the rigid stem in a horizontal crack, which was a constant of concern in the 'Gunks where I first used them. The "'Gunks rig" was invented to deal with this (the stems bend if loaded that way)... and the limitations are well known. The flexible stuff is, well, more flexible.
I like the idea of using them as art though, but I am a techie... not sure my wife would have that much of a sense of humor.
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jebel_andi
Dec 12, 2004, 9:45 PM
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In reply to: Myfriends need to be lubed up
HeHeHe!!
That sounds funny!! :D
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dr.ed
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Dec 12, 2004, 10:49 PM
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hey... what's wrong with lubing your friends...
http://cdbaby.com/mp3lofi/lyonsdana5-08.m3u
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eastvillage
Dec 12, 2004, 10:56 PM
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I have one old friend and a buddy of mine uses an entire rack of them (really old friends) for desperate climbs. All he did was get replacement trigger kits. You can use them with some old drilled hexes and everyone will think you're awesome!
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