Ironically, the BET slums are one of the least ridiculous environments here, largely because they post about nothing but baking, gardening, and pets.

Ironically, the BET group has had more climbing trips, weekends and unofficial gatherings than most other areas on the site. There are groups of 3-5 who regularly climb together a few times a month(or more) in 3 separate parts of the country.

Ironically, the BET group has had more climbing trips, weekends and unofficial gatherings than most other areas on the site. There are groups of 3-5 who regularly climb together a few times a month(or more) in 3 separate parts of the country.

included in the normal chatter there are trip reports, photos, gear reviews, and other climbing discussion. As far as i can tell the member with the least experience is still around 10 years.

since you are not included in the climbing trips, climbing discussion or much else perhaps you should re-read the thread title and OP?

Ironically, the BET group has had more climbing trips, weekends and unofficial gatherings than most other areas on the site. There are groups of 3-5 who regularly climb together a few times a month(or more) in 3 separate parts of the country.

included in the normal chatter there are trip reports, photos, gear reviews, and other climbing discussion. As far as i can tell the member with the least experience is still around 10 years.

since you are not included in the climbing trips, climbing discussion or much else perhaps you should re-read the thread title and OP?

That there's more climbing content and community in the BET thread than elsewhere on the site is not something for the BET crew to be proud of - IMHO it's something they should be ashamed of.

That there's more climbing content and community in the BET thread than elsewhere on the site is not something for the BET crew to be proud of - IMHO it's something they should be ashamed of.

Don't you think this is just a little... selfish? Exactly the sort of content that would otherwise attract people to the site and encourage them to post their own stories. The stuff that actually builds a community - and, incidentally, brings in the traffic to pay for the site that you're making free use of - and you hide it away in a thread that is deliberately made as uninviting and closed to outsiders as you can possibly make it.

That there's more climbing content and community in the BET thread than elsewhere on the site is not something for the BET crew to be proud of - IMHO it's something they should be ashamed of.

That's pretty funny. The truth is, all the climbing chatter is mixed in with the rest of the stuff. WHat's the alternative? Post a bunch of trip reports? I did that for a while, it's kind of fun, but at the end of the day it's mostly just spray. I'd rather just spray my buddies down and talk a little smack.

The BET is really just a chat room, and I prefer that format over the split forums. The model for those forums seems to be to ask a question and get a million responses, and then a couple guys wank about who is right and who is rong. Who cares? sez I.

And the whole point of the BET being semi- exclusive is so that it doesn't become like the rest of the site-- a million voices drowning each other out with idiocy. I prefer the idiocy of those I know. We don't need poster ratings, or star ratings or a search function, because you basically know the other posters, so there isn't the same choss to sift through.

The BET was born kind of because the rest of the site was going to shit in that there was just so much bad information being posted so often, that it became comical! It still is. You can log onto this site and read some insane stuff. If you have a certain sense of humor, it will make you laff. So you joke about it a bit with your friends.

That brand of humor ain't for everyone, and that's fine. There is a largely serious, humorless site out there called mountainproject, which is a great site and I use it quite a bit. This site is difficult to take seriously, because there is just so much stupid shit that gets posted.

Also... I think that often posters have a life cycle on sites. I don't think this site is very informative any more, because I've read probably 97% of any possible topics already. It is all going to be repetition at this point. If it wasn't for the big fun in the BET, I'd be long gone, because there's just not much for me ont he rest of the site, because it's geared to beginner Q&A questions, or the rare disagreement about belaying. Maybe that's why cracklover's friends bailed, because there was no new meaningful content. but, if they're only going to PM him, and not either contribute something worthwhile, or at least complain to a mod who could potentially but won't do something, I guess they don't get a vote.

+1 I've been here for coming up on 8 years. I had read just about all the shoe, gear, belaying, bolts, trad vs sport, threads there is in about a year. I quickly joined the Mass Climbers thread which was basically the original BET thread with a slightly different vibe but basically the same principle. That has since mostly died out due to many of the members moving away so I found other locals in the BET.

And what brings the new users in? New, interesting content. And who's the best at providing new, interesting (to n00bs) content? The established users.

Bullshit.

New, interesting content only interests a small minority of veteran websurfers. It's the same faces that have been here since the usernet days, with a few 'newbies' added in since. Take a look at the quantity of threads about shoes, ropes, which knot to tie ropes together, and I've been climbing X months, I just climbed 5.YYy in my gym, how long till I can climb 5.ZZzzzzz... Same damn questions over and over. People are too lazy to use the search box in the upper right, they're far too lazy to read a couple pages of educational discourse.

Two comments-

A) I wrote a very popular thread for a while here that I'm pretty sure had a lot of unique hits, but after a while it was wasn't worth it to me to write anymore, because I got relatively few responses for how long I spent writing the trip reports. Thousands of pageviews on that thread, and maybe 4 or 5 responses to each trip report that took me a few hours to write and edit.

ii) once upon a time, I was given free shoes (Free shooz!) to review. I wrote a gear review that was highly informative and, I think, pretty entertaining, duly submitted and the then-gear guy *never bothered to publish it*

You want rc.com to be worthwhile? You want it to be a vibrant and interesting community?

That's pretty funny. The truth is, all the climbing chatter is mixed in with the rest of the stuff. WHat's the alternative? Post a bunch of trip reports? I did that for a while, it's kind of fun, but at the end of the day it's mostly just spray. I'd rather just spray my buddies down and talk a little smack.

The BET is really just a chat room, and I prefer that format over the split forums. The model for those forums seems to be to ask a question and get a million responses, and then a couple guys wank about who is right and who is rong. Who cares? sez I.

And the whole point of the BET being semi- exclusive is so that it doesn't become like the rest of the site-- a million voices drowning each other out with idiocy. I prefer the idiocy of those I know. We don't need poster ratings, or star ratings or a search function, because you basically know the other posters, so there isn't the same choss to sift through.

The BET was born kind of because the rest of the site was going to shit in that there was just so much bad information being posted so often, that it became comical! It still is. You can log onto this site and read some insane stuff. If you have a certain sense of humor, it will make you laff. So you joke about it a bit with your friends.

Don't know anything about the shoe review - but I know the thread you're talking about. It got resurrected after almost a year just so someone could tell you how inspiring they found it. That has to count for something?

The point is that you contributed something (one of the better contributions on rc.com, actually) that added to the community spirit and interest on the site. That's exactly what we need - we just need the load spread over more people, so it's relatively easy for each individual. This next isn't directed at you:

Many people on this thread are bitching about how the rc.com community has fallen apart, about how all the good people have left, about how nobody posts anything worthwhile, and how rc.com is simply a n00b-infested cesspit now. They're bitching, and blaming the site management... and doing absolutely nothing to change it.

You want rc.com to be worthwhile? You want it to be a vibrant and interesting community? Then for goodness' sake, be a part of the community you want it to be. Be the sort of person you want to see posting. Build the critical mass that brings other interesting and knowledgable people in.

You can do that - or, you can bitch, and moan, and complain, and flame, and confine yourselves to your little enclaves, until one day rockclimbing.com comes up with nothing more than 404 Not Found - or, more likely, a cybersquatter site.

Nope. Perfectly happy with how it is now.

Hypothetical:

BET is deleted. All BET'ers get big bruises on their butts and decide to leave the site. Like, urry last one of them.

What effect do we see?

Do the number of (useful) responses to people's questions in the climbing forums go down? Perhaps by 1%? Less?

You may have join dates of 2001-2003, but, honestly, I don't see you carrying any leverage.

You may have started off as the RC.com community, but you have all alienated yourselves so far from what the community has become that your join dates really don't matter for much at all. If someone never even stepped foot in scummunity, he or she would not even know that 80% of you guys existed. Meatbomz is an absolutely prime example. I probably didn't even know the username existed for like 3 years after joining this site. I also realize that that is the way you like it, too.

Certainly, I can understand it if you're discouraged from participating in the climbing forums due to either

1) Unoriginal questions.
2) Noobs countering your sage advice.

That being said, rc.com would lose SUCH a miniscule portion of visitors if my hypothetical happened, so you should really realize that rc.com does not need you, but rather chooses to put up with you.

That being said, I'm sure you're all swell people, and would be fun to camp and climb with in real life.

Meanwhile, you have a personal attack lodged in your signature. You should be BANZed. You are probably not a swell person.

Heh, someone sounds butthurt.

To go on with your hypothetical, what effect do we see on the negative responses given in General, Beginners, A&E, etc... ? Perhaps 1% or less?

We usually don't play around outside of our scummunity except when someone gets an ingrown hair in their hemorrhoids - like today - and we latch on.

well you have a few facts wrong there spike.

We are actually the 2nd and 3rd gen 'community' or whatever of RC.com. The first two largely quit climbing, and whoever was left, left the site because their friends quit climbing. we still have rrradam, who boulders in a home woody once in a while.

the BET has already been locked. We're now in BET 2.0.

I am aware that we have little to no 'leverage' as you put it. This isn't really a concern to me. If I get the boot, or if the site shuts down, the world keeps on turning. It's everyone else who gets all upset about the BET. And that does not bother me.

Meanwhile, you have a personal attack lodged in your signature. You should be BANZed. You are probably not a swell person.

We are actually the 2nd and 3rd gen 'community' or whatever of RC.com. The first two largely quit climbing, and whoever was left, left the site because their friends quit climbing. we still have rrradam, who boulders in a home woody once in a while.

Huh?


OK, yeah. That's what I just said.

So, you're agreeing that we don't usually do much damage outside our little insiders thread, but saying that we don't hold much value either, so we should be pushed out of here? Is that just specific to us because you're still butthurt we didn't let you in, or are you going to be impartial and lobby for getting rid of all of community? Certainly we should be getting rid of the chat thread that you participate in daily, no? Perhaps we should have monthly evaluations to critique how much random users have participated and decide whether or not they should be voted off the island?

So, you're agreeing that we don't usually do much damage outside our little insiders thread, but saying that we don't hold much value either, so we should be pushed out of here? Is that just specific to us because you're still butthurt we didn't let you in, or are you going to be impartial and lobby for getting rid of all of community? Certainly we should be getting rid of the chat thread that you participate in daily, no? Perhaps we should have monthly evaluations to critique how much random users have participated and decide whether or not they should be voted off the island?

All of your post, especially the last bit, leads me to believe that you're alright--especially for a clown.

Edit: I wouldn't really count that first BET, so as the SPCI was locked for the same reason--volume, not anything else, really.

indeed. How about compare the actual climbing content discussed in You are not Wanted VS SPCI? hmm.. Kartessa's random babblings to herself for 2 pages in a row mighhhht hurt them. And that whole race to x000 posts by doing 1, 2 ,3, 4, 5 etc down a page might sting.

we do have content. you (spike) are just not wanted.

Ooooooooooh ok ok ok. Now I got what you were saying earlier. Well, first off, I make about 1-2 posts per day in the SPCI now. Secondly, I suppose I can understand where the BET is coming from since it apparently feels attacked by some of the posts in this thread.

A couple of the members did stir up the pot first though.

indeed. How about compare the actual climbing content discussed in You are not Wanted VS SPCI? hmm.. Kartessa's random babblings to herself for 2 pages in a row mighhhht hurt them. And that whole race to x000 posts by doing 1, 2 ,3, 4, 5 etc down a page might sting.

we do have content. you (spike) are just not wanted.

You read that thing?

meh. This thread got kind of funny and a bit interesting for a minute. Hard to resist when cracklover tries to tickle me with the ostrich feather, what can I say?

What is BET???

not very often.. i pop in once in a while to see what is going on.. the last time i did it was them counting and saying PC++ ++++ ++++++ for like 100 pages..

obviously you haven't GUd teh entire BET.

Fix: Search engine see: MP.com
Fix: Route database see: MP.com
Fix: Photo section including photo uploading see: MP.com
Fix: Killfile see: RC pre-ddt

Been asking for these changes for years and jack shit has been done about them. What is the point of helping a site that doesn't help back? When it was ran by MR, Adam, J_Ung the climbers on here had something to "work" for. And many many donated time and money to helping it. It's now owned by a corporation and ran by a guy across the world I don't know if anyone has met. People would be upset if it died while it was a General Store... not when it's a Walmart.

Hypothetical:

BET is deleted. All BET'ers get big bruises on their butts and decide to leave the site. Like, urry last one of them.

What effect do we see?

Do the number of (useful) responses to people's questions in the climbing forums go down? Perhaps by 1%? Less?

You may have join dates of 2001-2003, but, honestly, I don't see you carrying any leverage.

You may have started off as the RC.com community, but you have all alienated yourselves so far from what the community has become that your join dates really don't matter for much at all. If someone never even stepped foot in scummunity, he or she would not even know that 80% of you guys existed. Meatbomz is an absolutely prime example. I probably didn't even know the username existed for like 3 years after joining this site. I also realize that that is the way you like it, too.

Certainly, I can understand it if you're discouraged from participating in the climbing forums due to either

1) Unoriginal questions.
2) Noobs countering your sage advice.

That being said, rc.com would lose SUCH a miniscule portion of visitors if my hypothetical happened, so you should really realize that rc.com does not need you, but rather chooses to put up with you.

That being said, I'm sure you're all swell people, and would be fun to camp and climb with in real life.

not very often.. i pop in once in a while to see what is going on.. the last time i did it was them counting and saying PC++ ++++ ++++++ for like 100 pages..

I can't imagine where they might have learned this

That's because the username didn't exist until three years after you joined the site

Touche! Not too bad of estimating on my part. Haha. That being said, looking through a history of his posts the same would be said even if his account was 8 years old. Compare to someone like camhead who regularly posts to other forums on thissite.

It is a group of very bad people. Look away!

Hypothetical:

BET is deleted. All BET'ers get big bruises on their butts and decide to leave the site. Like, urry last one of them.

What effect do we see?

Do the number of (useful) responses to people's questions in the climbing forums go down? Perhaps by 1%? Less?

You may have join dates of 2001-2003, but, honestly, I don't see you carrying any leverage.

You may have started off as the RC.com community, but you have all alienated yourselves so far from what the community has become that your join dates really don't matter for much at all. If someone never even stepped foot in scummunity, he or she would not even know that 80% of you guys existed. Meatbomz is an absolutely prime example. I probably didn't even know the username existed for like 3 years after joining this site. I also realize that that is the way you like it, too.

Certainly, I can understand it if you're discouraged from participating in the climbing forums due to either

1) Unoriginal questions.
2) Noobs countering your sage advice.

That being said, rc.com would lose SUCH a miniscule portion of visitors if my hypothetical happened, so you should really realize that rc.com does not need you, but rather chooses to put up with you.

That being said, I'm sure you're all swell people, and would be fun to camp and climb with in real life.

But what about awl teh lurkers? What will happen to awl of them? Where will they awl go?

We contribute plenty. Teh BET v2 has 60450 posts and 928631 views. so that's like uhhh.... 870,000 more views than posts. Sumbody is reading awl that shit contributed content.

That doesn't tell me what it is.

well that is a lot of hogwash. A social contract to provide content?

Fix: Search engine see: MP.com
Fix: Route database see: MP.com
Fix: Photo section including photo uploading see: MP.com
Fix: Killfile see: RC pre-ddt

Been asking for these changes for years and jack shit has been done about them. What is the point of helping a site that doesn't help back? .

+1

Hypothetical:

BET is deleted. All BET'ers get big bruises on their butts and decide to leave the site. Like, urry last one of them.

What effect do we see?

Do the number of (useful) responses to people's questions in the climbing forums go down? Perhaps by 1%? Less?

You may have join dates of 2001-2003, but, honestly, I don't see you carrying any leverage.

You may have started off as the RC.com community, but you have all alienated yourselves so far from what the community has become that your join dates really don't matter for much at all. If someone never even stepped foot in scummunity, he or she would not even know that 80% of you guys existed. Meatbomz is an absolutely prime example. I probably didn't even know the username existed for like 3 years after joining this site. I also realize that that is the way you like it, too.

Certainly, I can understand it if you're discouraged from participating in the climbing forums due to either

1) Unoriginal questions.
2) Noobs countering your sage advice.

That being said, rc.com would lose SUCH a miniscule portion of visitors if my hypothetical happened, so you should really realize that rc.com does not need you, but rather chooses to put up with you.

That being said, I'm sure you're all swell people, and would be fun to camp and climb with in real life.

The BETers are responsible for zillions of page views, and hence revenue for the site. That's all that matters. This is a business. Ain't no social contract with someone making money off you.

Jay

What is BET???

It's obviously doing something for you, otherwise you wouldn't be here.

Bull. Advertisers are smarter than that. It's the rate of unique visitors that they tend to be mostly interested in. Regular repeat visitors, as the least likely to click on an ad, mean relatively little.

nope. i think i walked in on page 300 sumtin was just trying to plan a weekend of climbing and stayed.

not page 300 of the OGBET, that's for sure.

Prove that the page clicks on the BET thread generate little to no money for the site.

Jay

Not being privy to the internal workings of the rc.com business model, I of course cannot prove this - but I can make some informed predictions. If ddt's smart, he's hosting ads based upon the common model of payment per thousand views - under which model the BET thread would seem to be profitable. However - just about all advertisers filter the stats so that internal actions by users (posting, reloading, going to the next page, etc.) don't actually add to the count, but as far as I'm aware most of these actions do add to the "thread views" count. So to get a feel for how many views of the BET threads actually add to the site's revenue, divide that 900,000 views number by at least ten. So, 90,000 unique views in a year and a half? Yawn - if you want to be making real money out of a site, you need to be getting those sort of numbers per day.

Ironically, the BET group has had more climbing trips, weekends and unofficial gatherings than most other areas on the site. There are groups of 3-5 who regularly climb together a few times a month(or more) in 3 separate parts of the country.

included in the normal chatter there are trip reports, photos, gear reviews, and other climbing discussion. As far as i can tell the member with the least experience is still around 10 years.

since you are not included in the climbing trips, climbing discussion or much else perhaps you should re-read the thread title and OP?

blah, blah blah, petz, bakingz, gardenz, when's jack gonna post?

well that is a lot of hogwash. A social contract to provide content? the Knob had that bite at the apple, and ran off most anyone who knew what they were talking about just so they could coddle n00bs--those unique users you are after.

But what about awl teh lurkers? What will happen to awl of them? Where will they awl go?

We contribute plenty. Teh BET v2 has 60450 posts and 928631 views. so that's like uhhh.... 870,000 more views than posts. Sumbody is reading awl that shit contributed content.

...there are others who keep essentially all their posting confined to those threads - and that's a real waste.

Still, it's 90,000 views in a year and a half that wouldn't be there otherwise. That's revenue for the site with zero marginal cost. Free money.

Jay

+1. This site is a business for chrissake.

Jay

Um, more than 9/10 of your posts are in Scummunity or the S&F forum. Just sayin.

http://www.rockclimbing.com/...post_time&mh=250

Touche! Not too bad of estimating on my part. Haha. That being said, looking through a history of his posts the same would be said even if his account was 8 years old. Compare to someone like camhead who regularly posts to other forums on thissite.

all i can hear is

But there are others who keep essentially all their posting confined to those threads - and that's a real waste.

I've got a variety of other things going on in my life and when I come to the knob I just want to hang out with my imaginary internet friends. I'm knot here to entertain ewe!

That being said, I'm sure you're all swell people, and would be fun to camp and climb with in real life.

i was not around for the beginnings of BET so i don't know how much of that was in the beginning.

You know that thread in the Campground labelled "You are not wanted here"? The one with 60,000-odd posts in it?

Yeah, that's them.

Okay everyone - it's time for a moments silence for meatbombz's dignity.

*br br brrrrr br br brrrrrrrr*

But seriously, this is a climbing site. Not some "hi guys!" chat site. I think that we should not only ban JT and Curt and PTC, but also anyone that seems to be having too much fun. Climbing is NOT ABOUT FUN. It is about knots, grades, funky metal things, the gunks and strangely coloured shoes.

indeed. How about compare the actual climbing content discussed in You are not Wanted VS SPCI? hmm.. Kartessa's random babblings to herself for 2 pages in a row mighhhht hurt them. And that whole race to x000 posts by doing 1, 2 ,3, 4, 5 etc down a page might sting.

we do have content. you (spike) are just not wanted.

I felt offended by his signature slandering Sungam. Ad Hominem attacks in sigs should be a banzable offense.

What about drivel? That dude is a n00b.

well don't be fooled. We held the Coffee Shop's head under water until their legs stopped moving.

Yes. yes! Banz him nao!

Ad hominem attacks in sig lines should not be tolerated!



Wait, what? AB, are you defending my honour? How genteel of you.

it's funny because it's true

I think you've missed the point. Last time I checked, those forums didn't have the digital equivalent of a skull-and-crossbones and "members only" painted over the door.

I would imagine that scummunity is not the part of the site that generates those ever coveted "unique hits" you keep talking. 90% of the posts in scummunity are by the same people and soapbox can be a rather repulsive place at times. So, are you posting habits comparable to those of the BETers, no. Are they similar, yes.

And again, the SPCI is one of the more friendly and welcoming places in all of scummunity and we regularly gather new posters that stick around for awhile. Combine that fact with the number of lukers we have and I think you could make a pretty good case for the SPCI being one of this sites greatest assets. I think some kind of award, or even honorary status is in order.

I would imagine that scummunity is not the part of the site that generates those ever coveted "unique hits" you keep talking. 90% of the posts in scummunity are by the same people and soapbox can be a rather repulsive place at times. So, are you posting habits comparable to those of the BETers, no. Are they similar, yes.

And again, the SPCI is one of the more friendly and welcoming places in all of scummunity and we regularly gather new posters that stick around for awhile. Combine that fact with the number of lukers we have and I think you could make a pretty good case for the SPCI being one of this sites greatest assets. I think some kind of award, or even honorary status is in order.

We've been over this before.

You guys are the Little SPCI Achievers, disadvantaged users without the means for the necessary means to succeed in the BET. Proud we are of all of you.

You are making me/everyone want to post in the BET, it seems the only way I can call myself Elite.

I shall start promptly.

no it isn't.

do not.

Remember when I did so then doc feel good started spamming long ass posts in the SPCI, and you guys laffed?

Haha.

Oh yeah, then I did the exact same thing in BET and you guys cried.

Haha.

Oh yeah, and then a mod told me to stop or I'd be banned?

Haha.

Oh yeah, great modding.