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wsupoot
Jun 27, 2003, 9:12 PM
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I was recently out climbing at Granite Point Washington and I heard the rustle of leaves. Well I looked down and didn't see any leave where I heard the sound coming from and much to my amazement, and terror, there was an angry looking rattle snake "shakin it's thang for the men-folk" (Tommy Boy reference) about a foot and a half away from me. :shock: We are thinking it was a Western Diamondback, from looking at some info on rattlers.
So I yelled up at me partner who was climbing and told her to hold on whilst I swung around on top of a rock that was too high for the snake to reach (just below Hand Over Hand, if you know Granite Point). So I waited there and lowered her down so she could swing over to where I was. Then we waited for it to relax a little before we came off the rock and grabbed our stuff and made like trees and got out of there. Yeah, so we are wusses... :oops: I'm a city-boy and am only stuck here at WSU for school.
A few things:
1 - Anyone who climbs at Granite Point, WA ever seen (or heard for that matter) any Rattlers?
2 - Anyone across the country ever have this happen?
3 - Should I/we have handled this differently?
4 - Any other pertinent info would be welcomed, i.e. "next time bring Steve Irwin, he'll help you out!"
Disclaimer: I posted this in general as opposed to local beta because I figured it involved more than just our area.
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snowrocker
Jun 27, 2003, 9:37 PM
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Yesterday I went climbing up American Fork Canyon, Ut, and nearly stepped on a baby rattlesnake, those things are scary.
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ronamick
Jun 27, 2003, 9:38 PM
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Heck, San Diego is teeming with rattlers. We plow through chapparral that is fairly infested with those critters all the time. I've encountered about a dozen so far this year, and god knows how many in years past. Despite all of this contact, I have only really felt like I was in danger of being bitten one time, at Joshua Tree when I startled a 4' diamond back, causing him to rear back, and me to somehow standing broad jump about 20' to safety.
The key is awareness. The snakes want nothing to do with us, and will always flee given sufficient notice, which is accomplished by walking heavily so they will feel the ground vibration. Walk extremely warily in snake habitat, with an eye constantly to the ground. Rattlers can look exactly like a stick on the ground at first glance, so take off the shades and keep your eyes peeled. Most of the snakes that I see are trying to get away, so I stand still and watch them until they are out of sight, then go another direction.
If you walk fast and light in snake country, you are asking for it. Two things that will get you bitten are startling a snake, and stepping on a snake. You don't skin dive around sharks with a steak in your pocket, so use the same logic in dealing with rattlers.
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cjcalls
Jun 27, 2003, 9:43 PM
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I just catch them.
but thats part of what i do for a living.
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lemon_boy
Jun 27, 2003, 9:56 PM
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a few of my friends were climbing at shelf road last weekend (darkside) and a small rattlesnake fell from the top of the cliff and almost landed on tim the doctor. the snake was all jacked up, but it still rattled at them. then deputy DA thom put it out of its misery. although it took him about 12 attempts with big rocks to do so. apparently swinging his purse at it didn't get it done.
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thedesertnomad
Jun 27, 2003, 10:05 PM
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The only 2 experiences I have had with rattlers were both in Canyonlands, UT... one after a climb, unfortunately WITHOUT my headlamp, I was walking back to camp going through a little canyon and heard them (pretty much all over) I couldn't see them, so I would take a step, listen, re-direct if necessary, continue. It took me an hour to go maybe 100 yards.
The other time was far more startling. I was climbing in the Glen Canyon portion of Canyonlands (Cleopatra's Chair) and there tend to be prairie rattle snakes (about 18 inches long) living on pitch 1!!! They nestle up in the first few pocket holds and can scare the hell out of you. Apparently they can do a little climbing, cuz where I saw one, there was NO other way to have gotten there. We opted to bail on that one!!!
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elvislegs
Jun 27, 2003, 10:43 PM
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Yup. Almost got bit on Wed eve. Missed me by maybe a foot??
Tis' the season I guesse .
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wsupoot
Jun 27, 2003, 10:53 PM
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Elvislegs, Almost got bit where? Granite Point, or somewhere there in Idaho?!
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pinktricam
Jun 29, 2003, 12:33 PM
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I live in FL and see live ones often. They're all over the place in where I climb in NC. Have yet to see a live one there, but have often seen their shed skins.
And they're quite tastey, too! But you have to marinade (I use mojo criollo) them for at least a couple of days 'cause they could be a bit chewy :)
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billcoe_
Jun 29, 2003, 2:36 PM
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I got rattled at while leading a climb at Elgin Oregon. Yes, it scared the wholly hell out of me, pulling up face to face like it was, but it didn't ruin my day. We went and climbed elsewhere after a hasty downclimb/loweroff. FYI, a rattlesnake bite won't kill you (96% or the time).
I was in Australia,we were climbing in a more unpopulated part of the Arapiles area, a couple of Aussies on the route next to us were surprised when the follower, thats right, the follower, noticed a funnel web spider IN THE CRACK the leader had just passed by. You want to talk about dangerous? Oz has 6 of the top 10 most poisonous snakes on that continent. That's species, not individuals :lol: , and their poisonous spiders that would kick our 2 poisonous spiders asses (Black widow and Brown Recluses ) yet the people just happily continue on their merry way. Being careful of course.
Your more likely to have a rock fall on your head and get hurt bad taht way than a rattler.
No Worries mate:
Bill
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chuckd278
Jun 29, 2003, 4:50 PM
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Since moving to Idaho I have seen more rattlesnakes in 3 months than I ever did in 9 years of living in Oklahoma. They tend to be smaller, but just as scary. I have encountered them in Hells canyon, on the road up to the seven devils, and Mc Call. The only one that made me crap my pants was the one I stepped on at McCall. It was a small one, but that is worse. The little ones haven't learned to control thier bite so if you get bit by one it will inject toxins. Older ones learn to control when they release toxins. In other words even if it is a small snake don't play with it. Just let it be and move on. Even though I don't like them I don't kill them since I am the one finding them and they are not trying to find me.
Chuck
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keinangst
Jun 29, 2003, 5:04 PM
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In reply to: FYI, a rattlesnake bite won't kill you (96% or the time).
With or without antivenin? I would think that untreated, wilderness bites would be worse than that. How about amputations?
In reply to: their poisonous spiders that would kick our 2 poisonous spiders asses (Black widow and Brown Recluses )
Does the Banana Spider count, or are we just talking about species that are native to the US. The Banana Spider, IIRC, is like a "feral spider" in the states. I used to walk through their giant webs as a kid in FL, always scared the crap out of me... :shock:
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thedesertnomad
Jun 29, 2003, 5:09 PM
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In reply to: a rattlesnake bite won't kill you (96% or the time). Your more likely to have a rock fall on your head and get hurt bad taht way than a rattler. No Worries mate: Bill
True, chances are it will get out of sight long before you get there, and... if you do get bitten, technically only one in a thousand bites end up fatal, but... Rattlesnake bite injuries of the upper extremity have serious complications and at least one third of cases, include local soft tissue necrosis (most common complication)
http://
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hangdoggypound
Jun 29, 2003, 5:47 PM
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In reply to: ...grabbed our stuff and made like trees and got out of there.
In reply to: True, chances are it will get out of sight long before you get there, and... if you do get bitten, technically only one in a thousand bites end up fatal, but... Rattlesnake bite injuries of the upper extremity have serious complications and at least one third of cases, include local soft tissue necrosis (most common complication)
In reply to: a rattlesnake bite won't kill you (96% or the time).
I've encountered several rattlesnakes over the years at Arizona crags, and from what I've noticed is that they just don't want to be bothered and will scamper away if you give them their space. I'd say jumping up on top of a rock and leaving was a fine idea. I've done the same.
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jono
Jun 29, 2003, 6:07 PM
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i climb GP all the time and never saw one but there are lots of good places for them to live and they are crawling all over that area.
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tradclimber2
Jun 30, 2003, 3:17 PM
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Yesterday we were hiking back from a great day climbing and were walking thru some manzanita. My partner behind me noticed that I had just passed a baby rattler by about a foot. He saw it only because he caught movement out of the corner of his eye. I had this happen once before - the person in the lead usually does not see the snake first, the second in line on a trail usually see it first, after the first person just misses it. They are VERY difficult to see, especially if they are not moving, so everyone just be careful out there and LOOK BEFORE YOU STEP!
It seems that there are a LOT of snakes out this year, much more than usual for our area.
BTW, we let the little guy just crawl away and he rewarded us with a great pose under the shrubs - got a great photo of him/her. You do not have to kill them, they really do have an important purpose in the ecosystem. Kill only the ones that actually chase YOU down the trail - the ones that are trying to eat YOU.
Ben
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gretchino
Jun 30, 2003, 3:40 PM
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In reply to: Heck, San Diego is teeming with rattlers.
I'll second that...unfortunately the more houses they build here (which is 100's per year, the poor things are loosing their habitat faster than ever before...
Just be careful and all the other good advice I've just read in this thread... :)
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xanx
Jun 30, 2003, 3:52 PM
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from everything i have heard, your best bet in rattler country is to stomp on the ground every now and then, just to let them know you are coming. then they have ample time to scamper into their little burrows or under a rock, and you will never even see them. it's when they don't know you are coming that problems occur.
as for snakes/spiders on a route.... i think i would bail. rattler bites can easily lead to the loss of use of a digit (fingers ect... turn black, like a bad burn), or amputation. especially if u are in a remote place far from a hospital. that's another thing: i think it would be a good idea to always know where the closest hospital is if u are climbing somewhere new - sht happens.
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thedesertnomad
Jun 30, 2003, 3:57 PM
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One more thing to be aware of. I have seen this especially in Canyonlands... I was always used to hanging bear bags coming from the North East and extensive backpacking through Grizzly territory in NM and CO, but... in the desert I found it a good idea to hang mouse bags... lol the more mice you have in your campsite, the more rattlesnakes that will come in for dinner.
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pinktricam
Jun 30, 2003, 5:58 PM
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[quote="xanx"]from everything i have heard, your best bet in rattler country is to stomp on the ground every now and then, just to let them know you are coming. then they have ample time to scamper into their little burrows or under a rock, and you will never even see them. it's when they don't know you are coming that problems occur.In reply to: Good point...also, when coming upon a fallen tree on the trail, don't swing your leg over it and step immediately to its other side, instead, step onto the tree and well away from it on the other side, this avoiding any nasty surprises!
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pinktricam
Jun 30, 2003, 6:00 PM
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In reply to: from everything i have heard, your best bet in rattler country is to stomp on the ground every now and then, just to let them know you are coming. then they have ample time to scamper into their little burrows or under a rock, and you will never even see them. it's when they don't know you are coming that problems occur.
Good point...also, when coming upon a fallen tree on the trail, don't swing your leg over it and step immediately to its other side, instead, step onto the tree and well away from it on the other side, thus avoiding any nasty surprises!
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tradclimber2
Jun 30, 2003, 6:47 PM
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In reply to: ... in the desert I found it a good idea to hang mouse bags... lol the more mice you have in your campsite, the more rattlesnakes that will come in for dinner.
Ben
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ronamick
Jul 1, 2003, 1:38 AM
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I just saw on the history channel that you are more likely to die from a black widow's bite than a rattler's. We'll need a retrobolter if we're going to test that assertation.
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alpinerock
Jul 1, 2003, 3:18 AM
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My first experiance with rattle snakes was before i started climbing, Some friends and I were hiking down lone peak and my friend (lpclimber) was in the lead, after a little bit he saw a snake on the side of the road and knowing me pointed it out said "snake" and got the heck out of the way cause he knew that i would grab it well, as u probaly guessed i dropped to my knees and grabbed it only then, noticing the rattle at the end of its tail luckily it was a baby and not very fast so i was able to let go and back up without and harm coming to me of the snake(i guess the snake gene must run in the family because about a month ago we ran into another rattler and my brother knowing ly tried to catch it and almost succeded before it started rattling)
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sid_rock
Jul 1, 2003, 3:40 AM
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I saw a black mamba while climbing the other day. I threw a stone at it.
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elvislegs
Jul 1, 2003, 3:03 PM
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In reply to: Elvislegs, Almost got bit where? Granite Point, or somewhere there in Idaho?!
No, sorry for the misunderstanding, up at Table Rock in Boise.
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billcoe_
Jul 4, 2003, 12:45 AM
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My 2nd favorite rattler story takes place at Smith Rock with the late Dave Hespereth.
I was guiding that day, including Dave as a client, who was an incredibly strong, well rounded outdoorsperson. I always liked guiding guys like that, who could get up 5.10 trad with ease, but most interesting was the fact that Dave had a Hugh Herr style metal leg on his right leg, having lost it previously for some reason or another. Didn't seem to slow him down climbing however.
We decide to go up Koala rock area to get away from the crowds and see if there was a breeze (there was). We finished for the day and are toasted and tired, walking down the remote Burma road when.......... Zap, like electricity we hear the disgruntled and angry rattling sound. Sure enough, a huge 7' Rattler (this is a typical western Diamondback, they grow 2" everytime somebody tells this story, since this was years ago and it really was a fat snake, abeit about 4' long in reality), anyway, this 7'2" snake rears up and rattles right next to Dave. Everybody freezes EXCEPT Dave, who is the closest, he fairly quickly pulls his painters pants up to reveal a Metal pole where a leg normally is: Says Dave, "Go ahead you son of a bitch and see where it gets you".
Dave drowned about 6 months later while kayaking on the Salmon river when it was at huge flood stage, he was a good guy, and from all accounts a real kick assed kayaker: Well, he was a good enough fella that the rattler made peace and left him alone.
This is a true story, but I'd forgotten about it until right now. Like most wersterners, I have a staple of about 20 snake stories, best told around the fire after a couple of beers.
Bill
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billcoe_
Mar 5, 2005, 5:55 AM
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A little girl found a rattler IN the camp 4 area at Yosemite. I saw this monster, it was almost as long as this little kid. Probably showed up to eat those nuisance squirels.
She got a ranger and he hauled it off. Might have put it at the base of El Cap for all I know, seem to have a few up that way.
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chemicalclimber
Mar 5, 2005, 7:15 AM
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hey elvislegs, what is the season for rattlers around the black cliffs? I imagine pretty much now until late fall? I think I want to watch my step a bit better when I walk up tomorrow.... :shock:
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over_the_hill
Mar 5, 2005, 7:20 AM
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Here is a story for all of you. In 1988, I was bitten by a rattlesnake. Not a fun experience to be sure. The damn thing struck me on the back side of my left calf, as I was running down a trail. At fist, I thought that some brush had "whipped" me ( the trail was very overgrown), then I saw the strange marks on my leg. As I stopped to look back up the trail, I saw the snake recoil and start to rattle. ( insert you favorite swear words here) I thought, now what??? All alone. Still a mile from the car. NO ONE knows I am here!! No first aid kit. No cell phone (like any climber could afford a cell phone in 1988). Nothing else to do other than get to the car and drive to help!! Within 15 minutes, my leg was suffering from severe "pins and needles". 20 minutes I lost the use of it. Since my car was a clutch car, I was now stuck in third gear. I made it all the way to an Insta-care facilty, where I received "immediate" treatment! The bitten area was severy swollen and white, much like someone had stuck a hard boiled egg under the skin. My body was profusly sweating, and I was going into shock. I had three seizures on the table, where my body tried to fold in half (back bends). Eventually, the seizures stopped, the fluid loss stopped, and the swelling subsided (six hours or so). I was sent home with strict instructions to be observed for the next 48 hours. The puncture wounds went black, and eventually healed after a year. Needless to say, not a fun day.
So, Having a bit of experience with rattlesnakes, I want to offer this advise to everyone:
1: Wear good sturdy approach shoes! (this would not have helped me though)
2: Keep your eyes peeled for possible areas snakes might be.
3: Do your best to avoid the snake, and it will try to avoid you too.
4: Always carry a first aid kit, and know what to to for a variety of wilderness emergencies.
5: Try to never travel alone. Aaron Ralston can vouch for this one.
6: If you are bitten, try to identify the species (or kill it), this will help your medical professionals with the proper treatment.
7: Know and respect your enviroment, and it will respect you too.
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billcoe_
Mar 7, 2005, 3:23 AM
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In reply to: 6: If you are bitten, try to identify the species (or kill it), this will help your medical professionals with the proper treatment.
"(or kill it)" WTF? Sounds like if you had slowed down to "kill it" you would not be here today. Are you saying that a Western Diamondback" anti-venom is different than a "Sidewinders" or something similar, and that medical personel need this info? :?:
Throughout the West, rattlers are usually Western Diamondbacks, and unless you're looking at a Coral Snake climbing in Az, you got bit by a poisonous snake, it's a rattler: "rattler" isn't enough info for the Doctors?
Hmmm:shock:
PS, I'm working on my thread revival skills. :lol:
Regards:
bill
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kubi
Mar 7, 2005, 3:26 AM
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In reply to: You don't skin dive around sharks with a steak in your pocket, so use the same logic in dealing with rattlers.
Wait....why would you skin-dive with a steak in your pocket around rattlers?
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over_the_hill
Mar 7, 2005, 5:52 AM
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Yes Bill, there is more than one species of rattlesnake in the west. Each snake has a different type of venom, and effects the body in different ways.
Try watching Venom ER on the animal planet channel. I am sure that you will learn a thing or two about venomous snakes in the west.
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bandycoot
Mar 7, 2005, 7:25 AM
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Do trekking poles help with the rattler problem?
About the different poisons, the mojave rattler (can be found in J-Tree) can have quite a deadly neurotoxin in its poison. I think that I saw one out there once. Pretty little thing!
Josh
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