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uzziah
Mar 20, 2005, 7:57 AM
Post #51 of 74
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In reply to: Toyota - Pickup: Don't bother (unless you have the dinero) to get a Tacoma as it's more or less the same as a Pickup repackaged and you'll weep more when you f&ck up the paint job...yet again. The extra cab is nice but the standard cab wheelbase approaches that of a Jeep, if that matters. Great offroad, but don't expect to blow people off the line in the city. One of the great Japanese imports. 1985 and earlier had solid axles (like the Jeeps) but 82-97 (including some Tacomas) is good. Four-Runner: The original and much copied SUV - here's who to blame! Ditto the Pickup apecs except it comes (optional) with four doors, 4 seats and all the (factory covered) space of the pickup bed. A predictable high-quality, well-made, low-maintenance ride. 92-96 are muy bueno. Land Cruiser: These things are badass and very popular worldwide for getting you and all your s--- to where you want to go in style. The older models (pre 1991) are what you really want as they are slow, steady and tough as nails. Not the most fuel-efficient but it's all shades of gray isn't it? The 84-90 models are exceptional. Jeep - Cherokee: Get the 2 or 4 door (more convenient) model with the 4.0 litre engine (HO for more power/fun) and get a very capable offroad rig that has a fair amount of room if you go somewhat light. Look at the 90-96 models for best luck. Grand Cherokee - Not much experience with this, but it seems more hit or miss than the Cherokee. A plusher ride, but less predictable. Kudos if you can find a good one. Not sure the good years for this. Subarau - These are mostly unfamiliar with me but I hear they go and go. Perhaps somebody else can vouch for this. Otherwise, remember that your rig only gets you so far...and then you have to rope up.
now that's just excellent, much appreciated advice.
ps: the jeep cherokee and toyota 4runner are my top choices right now. i think i lean towards the 4runner as i mainly need the sleeping-quality and the off-road quality is really AN AFTERTHOUGHT. i'll only be going off road around CO to get to some obscure approaches, and i won't be going to NV to do desert climibng all that often. the off-road capability is really just this: there ARE SOME approaches that i'll need decent clearance 4wd to get to, and i just don't want to miss out on them. mainly though, this car will be used for (in order of frequency:)
1. driving out on weekend trips (every weekend for me is a road-trip weekend :) ) and "camping" overnight in the car
2. driving round town and picking up stuff (nice to have more space - boulder freecycle has been offering me tons of good furniture etc. and for moving will save me much $$ - yes, this is option number 2: why? becasue i'll be taking the bus to CU Boulder starting next fall, so won't be driving much, and my wife works at CU and takes bus -great thing about boulder)
3. going out on week-long trips etc. to BC, Nevada, the needles in CA etc.
ps: looks like $7k for 100k miles is a good, reasonable price (believe it or not). looks like 1995 an older is more my price range. do they all have the crappy engine??? can i actually get it fully repared/replaced? should i just forget about anything older than 96?
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uzziah
Mar 20, 2005, 8:31 AM
Post #52 of 74
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ps: fuel-economy is "important" to me - i was actually considering buying a toyota echo before i reallized how much i wanted to be able to sleep in the vehicle. but, i really won't be driving it much except on the weekends, so that lessens the blow.
my current thought: get a 1996 or later 4runner. remove the rear seats (i don't imagine it'll be too difficult?? - it's just me and my wife or my and a partner all the time anyway) and build a wooden platform maybe a couple feet high, and put a mattress on top of it- maybe foam maybe air. use the space under the platform to store gear (and maybe a sub?? :twisted: ). i really like this idea. i also have a hard time not admitting that i'm a rather a toyota-fanboy. i think i'll raise my price limit to $8k as well, though i'd rather spend $7k
a couple worthy ones:
http://autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?car_id=179170070&dealer_id=56041418&car_year=1987&make=TOYOTA&distance=300&lang=en&max_price=8000&model=4RUN&sponsorModel=&sort_type=mileageASC&end_year=2006&min_price=1&certified=&address=80303&search_type=both&advanced=&start_year=1981&isp=y&cardist=33
http://autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?car_id=177722902&dealer_id=446364&car_year=1990&make=TOYOTA&distance=300&lang=en&max_price=8000&model=4RUN&sponsorModel=&sort_type=mileageASC&end_year=2006&min_price=1&first_record=26&pager.offset=25&certified=&address=80303&search_type=both&advanced=&isp=y&start_year=1981&cardist=28
http://autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?car_id=179439029&dealer_id=5641175&car_year=1995&make=TOYOTA&distance=300&lang=en&max_price=8000&model=4RUN&sponsorModel=&sort_type=mileageASC&end_year=2006&min_price=1&first_record=26&pager.offset=25&certified=&address=80303&search_type=both&advanced=&isp=y&start_year=1981&cardist=29
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uzziah
Mar 20, 2005, 10:22 AM
Post #53 of 74
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that older 4runner looks very intriguing
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bigeastcoastsissy
Mar 20, 2005, 2:55 PM
Post #54 of 74
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Registered: Feb 27, 2004
Posts: 23
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I've got a '94 Grand Cherokee with a 4.5" suspension lift, 32" tires, fog lights, and a thule cargo basket. This thing's awesome. It's got 152,000 mi. on it, and purr's like a kitten, but with the 318 small block V8, I've got all the power in the world. As soon as I do the full brake upgrade, the thing will be perfect. I can easily fit enough stuff on and in it to climb and paddle for a full weekend. I could probably fit all my bike stuff in it, too...but haven't tried the tri-fecta weekend trip yet.
Bryan
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anykineclimb
Mar 20, 2005, 3:12 PM
Post #55 of 74
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Registered: Mar 30, 2003
Posts: 3593
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I'm rather partial to Jeep's
I current own an 87 Cherokee with 3" lift and 30" tire.
it can be finicky at times but it is nearly 20. you know how teenagers are.
I would have rather have a mid nineties due to the H.O. engine and more toys available for the engine (aftermarket)
All that said, My next vehicle will most likely be a Toyota. most likely a Taco or possibly a 4Runner. I drive a Landcruiser at work and LOVE the damn thing, comfortable, fast decent mileage and looks cool.
Of course the other vehicle I'm checking out is the new Jeep Liberty Diesel
great mileage and like, 40% more torque. Its more than $8k so its not even on your radar.
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boardline22
Mar 20, 2005, 3:50 PM
Post #56 of 74
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Registered: Feb 18, 2005
Posts: 652
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Get a Jeep, excellent car I have owned 2 both the cherokee and grand cherokee, the grand cherokee is for those fancy people, and the cherokee is the one you will use and use, but without the comfrot of the grand (seat warmers, 10 disc CD player, sun roof, etc...) They are both good. I've had more problems with the Dodge durango in the last 2 years then I've had with the Jeeps for 10 years
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boulderinemt
Mar 21, 2005, 3:13 PM
Post #57 of 74
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Registered: Feb 9, 2003
Posts: 282
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you must get the dodge ram 2500 turbo diesel. put a shell on the thing, engineer a platform, and your set. mine only cost 17,000 dollars. a small price to pay, when you get the privelege of spending 2.39 a gallon for diesel. :roll:
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abtisme
Mar 21, 2005, 3:38 PM
Post #58 of 74
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Posts: 50
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for sure go with the cherokee. ive had two, and 96 2wd 4.0L inline 6 and now i drive my 97 4x4 4.0L inline 6. the inline six is the way to go, plenty of low end torque and better gas mileage than most SUVs. plus, its the easiest engine in the world to work on, not like a subaru or a 4runner where everything is so cramped that you have to have a professional to work on it because there is so much stuff in there that you can't see whats going on. the 97 has 117K miles and the 96 has 132K miles and neither of them leak any oil. and if you want cupholders, get a 97 or newer. the older ones have an add on, but its just something to think about if you are gonna be driving long distances. both of my jeeps are manuals and i love the crap out of them. and as long as you aren't 7 feet tall, folding the rear seat down and going to sleep is no problem. (ive had two, not because one died, but because i wanted 4 wheel drive, and now my dad is driving the 96) hope this helps
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yetanotherdave
Mar 21, 2005, 4:06 PM
Post #59 of 74
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Registered: Mar 19, 2005
Posts: 243
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I lived in a dodge tradesman panel van for years.
Lots of room, and they're almost as generic and invisible as taxis, which is important if you're in a city.
You can generally get an old white panel van for < $1000, and they're generally cheap to run. Except for the mileage, which sucks.
Advice: thick dark curtains, so your lights inside aren't as visible after dark.
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skinner
Mar 21, 2005, 4:22 PM
Post #60 of 74
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In reply to: jeep gives me hives. those things are reliability-nightmares. they leek oil et.c most unreliable vehicle on the road
I'm creeping up on 300k on my 93 Jeep Grande Cherokee.
In 12 years
(2) fuel pumps due to an additive in Shell Tecroline gas which dissolved seals
(1) electrical problem in the steering column from titlting the steering
wheel for 12 years.
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bigjohnny
Mar 21, 2005, 4:33 PM
Post #61 of 74
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Registered: Dec 23, 2004
Posts: 28
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One little warning about Yotas and all imports for that matter. Parts are expensive. My vote is for the Cherokee. If being off-radar is important then definatly the Cherokee. So many of those things on the road it's crazy. Now if you want something a little cooler get yourself an old Grand Wagoneer. Mileage will suck, but it's a big SUV with plenty of U involved. You should be able to pick one up for pretty cheap and keep it running for cheap as well. One thing that will help with mileage with any 4x4 you get is to convert to manual front hubs. Cost you about 500-700$ to do, but you'll see a HUGE improvement in mileage, as much as 50% is some trucks, and you'll save a lot of wear and tear on the front end when you're not four-wheeling.
As far as subies go, AWD is great for icey roads, but does you nothing off-road.
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areuinclimber
Mar 21, 2005, 4:55 PM
Post #62 of 74
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Registered: May 29, 2004
Posts: 436
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well, i'll chock one up for the 1984-1989 toyota 4-runner. why?
here is why:
-i can fill up in the east bay (sf bay area), drive all the way to tahoe and still have enough gas to get back, and IN to san francisco. yes thats right, the best gas milage i have ever winessed fro a car that size,
- this car open up (windows everywhere, entire rear top section comes off.)
- the engine is the easiest to work on (just look under the hood of one).
- parts for these cars are NOT expensive (to contrast with the above poster)
- rear seats fold down with no effort leave you room to stretch out completely (have done this many times)
- there is a factory roll bar (probably useless but screams to be modified for hanging/mounting gear, a bed, hanging stove, what ever you want)
- the fact that they are all 4wd and wheel as good as a jeep with less than half the problems of one (owned 2 jeeps in the family so far and both have taken/ are currently taking shits).
- for your price range, they are not expensive at all, an excellent condition, low milage rig can be had for $3000. mine has 190,000 and i just drove it from the bay area (hayward) to vegas and back (only filled up once each way mind you).
- comes from the factory with manual locking hubs.
bad points:
- slower then cold dog shit (can probably be fixed, lcengineering.com)
- body's are junk as they rust easily (bodies, not frame)
- up hill is a joke, (doesnt really waste gas when hammering on the throttle though)
- check the head gasket, as the original yota ones are prone to blowing (if your in the bay area i will swap yours out in a weekend for a case a brews!)
and that is about it.
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tigerbythetail
Mar 21, 2005, 5:06 PM
Post #63 of 74
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In reply to: requirements: 1. able to sleep in and be low-profile. i.e. vw campers are out (they're out anyway because of reliability and awful-in-snow) i live in CO. i want to be able to sleep anywhere without someone knowing i'm there 2. 4wd 3. under $7k desireables: (in order of wanted) 1. reliability 2. manual transmission 3. gas mileage
With that in mind here's another look at some of the choices:
Toyota - Can easily sleep in the back of a pickup, they turf pretty well (standard cab is better with the shorter wheelbase) but they hold their value quite well so under $7K means an older, higher mileage vehicle unfortunately. They are very reliable, offer stick shift, and get decent mileage. Your best bet might be to pick up an older suare-body (pre '91) Landcruiser for what you want to spend - it may need some money but it'll get you most anywhere with lots of room; gas mileage is of course a downside.
Jeep - the Cherokee's are great (if you get a good one, and most are), you can pick a used one up for under $7K no problem, the 4WD shift-on-the-fly is handy and they turf offroad like you won't believe (even stock models), the 4.0L HO engine is bulletproof and the one to get - the power of the motor will put any Toyota (or most cars) to shame. Standard transmission is available but harder to find. Unfortunately they aren't very roomy & you'd be hard pressed to sleep inside (especially if you are tall), overall they have a cheaper interior and are noiser inside as well. Pretty sure the GC is automatic only (and not very reliable AFAIK) so cross it off the list.
Subaru - as pointed out go forever but are small and lack true 4WD so cross it off the list.
Others - people I know have had Ford Ranger (they have a 4.0L motor as well), Chevy S-10 and Nissan pickups with varying degrees of success.
One reason the Japanese brands are so coveted and retain their value is because they last (regularly over 200K or 300K miles) and are generally well built. Get a copy of Truck Trader magazine at your local 7-11, Circle K whatever and check it out (or go online to autotrader.com). Two thirds of the magazine is devoted to people selling Ford, Chevy and GM trucks. Toyota and Nissan are small sections (think about that). Good luck and do some online searches for more info if you care to.
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ropesologuy
Mar 21, 2005, 5:39 PM
Post #64 of 74
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F250 4x4 with a canopy is my climbing mobile of choice good in mud rock and snow
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goodwholesomeboy
Mar 21, 2005, 5:58 PM
Post #65 of 74
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Registered: Apr 16, 2004
Posts: 108
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i know that you are wanting to keep a low profile but i'd have to recommend and ambulance. i recently got one and it was the best decision of my life.
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uzziah
Mar 23, 2005, 7:12 AM
Post #66 of 74
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Registered: Oct 5, 2004
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In reply to: i know that you are wanting to keep a low profile but i'd have to recommend and ambulance. i recently got one and it was the best decision of my life.
(hope you're not married, dude :) ) -best decision of life........errrr...
neat idea, BUT: i have been an EMT and all i can say is that ambulances are treated worse then nearly any other vehicle on the road simply because: they are turned on, gas slammed on , and their going flying down the streat after they've been sitting for hours without even heating up. so, i think not; but thanks for the advice
here's my issue with the cherokee: can i remove the rear seats??? same question for 1st gen 4runner. i lean towards the 4runner. what i'd like to do is build a platform back there with cabinets underneath to hold gear. mattress on top of platform. i am 6ft, so i'm afraid the jeep is too cramped. if i can't sleep WELL in the car i'll buy, it's not worth it to me to get such a big vehicle. i think with a platfrom in a 1st gen runner, sleeping with my head towards the rear, with the front seats folded down a bit, maybe my feet sticking off a tad, i'd be doing fine. thouhgts?
a friend of mine (anyone know a Ben Gilkonson? yosemite), had an old pacbell van that he sleeped in, but then again he was 5ft nothng :)
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mrsmylie
Mar 23, 2005, 8:37 AM
Post #67 of 74
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Posts: 88
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my friend just got a nissan frontier w/manual, 4wd, and the dealer found a topper and put in a custom framed padded bed to his specs for around $8500. it only had 75,000 miles on it. my friend found the tacomas consistently ran $2000 more. it was a '99 too.
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cchildre
Mar 23, 2005, 3:06 PM
Post #68 of 74
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I am 5' 11" and I don't have any trouble sleeping in the back of my Cherokee. I can sleep diagonaly and my feet touch the tailgate just a tad. You could very easily remove the rear seat and build a simple platform to replace it. You would have plenty of storage underneath with more than ample room to sleep. Get some extra dark window tinting and you will be set to park and sleep almost anywhere. If your planning on living out of it I would suggest installing a second battery to power the radio and anything else you might utilize while the engine is not running. This could be easily located under the platform you build and a $40 relay will alternately charge the battery, but that could be overcomplicating things for you. 4-runners are nice but the jeeps are just so plentiful and spare parts abound. The 4-wheel drive is a great addition as well.
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ter_bee
Jul 5, 2005, 1:48 AM
Post #69 of 74
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Registered: Feb 20, 2004
Posts: 418
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All these people gave free advice, and we never get to hear the decision. What did you do? What's the climbingMobile?
You said, "sleeped." :-)
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lagarita
Jul 5, 2005, 5:02 AM
Post #70 of 74
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Registered: Dec 23, 2004
Posts: 356
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In reply to: In reply to: Jeep Cherokee!!! the only way to go... best suv ever made. We have two, one we have has 250,000+ miles. They are great off road and have lots of sleeping room. The best years they were made were: 91-93 4.0L and 97 and later 4.0L. Other than that i would look at the 98 Grand Cherokee Limited 5.9L.... These are the CREAM OF THE CROP Jeeps (that are big enough to sleep in) If you have any questions about these jeeps just ask. ok, you've got me interested. my impression on jeeps are that they are absolute reliability disastors. are you saying yours just "ran" that long, or that you actually had few problems during that tme? my experience with jeep is that they leek oil, break down and alltogether are just awful vehicles, off road exluded
I own a 98 Jeep grand cherokee limited 4.0L. I bought it used with 80K on it and didn't think twice about paying $9,000 for it. It has 150K on it now and the only major repairs I did on it were to replace the transmision gasket.
My whole family owns Jeeps; my father just retired a '92 cherokee laraedo with 220K, he replaced it with a '00 grand cherokee sport V8, my sister owns a '98 cherokee sport, and her boyfriend has a 99' grand cherokee laraedo.
Reliability, you can't get more reliable then a jeep straight 6. I don't know the exact statistics but I know that jeeps have been through several wars and keep going.
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climbsomething
Jul 5, 2005, 5:39 AM
Post #71 of 74
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We have a 95 Cherokee, 2 WD, automatic, and while I am not qualified to critique it too much (I don't drive it) it performs admirably as a Big Metal Tent (tm). Not our dream car but it goes vroom, and it has some nice desert pinstriping. Gas mileage is okay, not stellar. We've had issues with it though. There's this design flaw: go flying over a bumpy (but not 4WD) dirt road fast and hard enough and you'll put a nice gash the transmission lines, which is just not cool. Or cheap. I know nothing of this snow thing you speak of. It can crush small cacti and scrub bushes though, but only when they jump in front of the car (heh... I have driven it a few times).
Sleeping in it is a bit uncomfortable if you have 2 people. Alex is 6'1 and it's just a leeeetle too short for him even with the back hatch open. He also tends to steal the mattress/crash pad, blankets and general breathing room from me by way of shoving me into the wheel well...
Prior to that we had an 87 Subaru GL hatchback. It's ugly, it smells, it's loud, and it's small, but it's 4WD. And it's the Adventure Subie and covered in climbing stickers so street cred is guar-an-teed, right? :P
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bandidopeco
Jul 5, 2005, 7:38 AM
Post #72 of 74
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Registered: Mar 17, 2004
Posts: 257
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Toyota: The choice of the Taliban.
Aside from that I own a Subaru, and it's done very well. Good milage, great in the snow and long lasting.
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ninja_climber
Jul 5, 2005, 9:37 PM
Post #73 of 74
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Registered: Apr 10, 2005
Posts: 403
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Jeep Wrangler?
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vulcan
Jul 6, 2005, 4:55 AM
Post #74 of 74
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Registered: Mar 7, 2005
Posts: 20
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I own an 88 Toyota Truck. Standard Cab, manual with a camper shell. I love my truck. Get a Four banger. They are the most reliable, and get the best gas. I don't see why anybody would want anything else. I just don't have any respect for jeeps, they are made poorly. Toyota trucks are engineered superbly. Cheap, relaible, easy on gas, good off road or snow or mud or water.
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