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tyson16v
May 7, 2005, 7:08 PM
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this post is better than any book. different insights from different people. awesome.
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sidepull
May 21, 2005, 6:55 PM
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I'm curious why 30 minutes is a magic number for ARCing. Is there a physiological reason? The logic in PRC seems to be more pyschological, e.g. climbing for 30 minutes gets you used to being in a vertical environment.
The reason I ask is that I have been using a hangboard to ARC and I find that more than 15 minutes is just too boring. Also, because I'm taking my weight off my legs get tired. This was also true when I was trying to ARC indoors, I'd have to climb on slabs most of the time and my calves would get really tired. Any thoughts? I want to be training my fingers not my legs.
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fluxus
May 21, 2005, 8:28 PM
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In reply to: I'm curious why 30 minutes is a magic number for ARCing. Is there a physiological reason? The logic in PRC seems to be more pyschological, e.g. climbing for 30 minutes gets you used to being in a vertical environment.
I don't think that 30min. is exactly a magic number, since you can get benefits from shorter durations, specifically climbers who are new to ARCing.
To get a benefit from any training you need to surpass the requirments of the performance you are training for in either intensity or duration. ARCing is about surpassing the requirments in terms of duration, and in the long run raising the intensity you can handle for long periods. Look at on-sighting sport routes, say a 40 - 60 Ft. route at Rifle. Such attempts may take on average 10 minutes on the outside, ARCing for 15 minutes is not much of a training stimilus for that specific performance, where as 20 - 30 min ARCs would be.
In reply to: The reason I ask is that I have been using a hangboard to ARC and I find that more than 15 minutes is just too boring.
I don't think its really possible to ARC on a hang board. There is no movement there, and the difference between 15 min. hanging on holds and 15 minutes climbing is huge. If its all you have then so be it, its probably a lot better than nothing.
In reply to: Also, because I'm taking my weight off my legs get tired. This was also true when I was trying to ARC indoors, I'd have to climb on slabs most of the time and my calves would get really tired. Any thoughts? I want to be training my fingers not my legs.
Needing to stay on the slab for most of the time is direct evidence that your endurance level is very very low. This is how you know that you really need to work on endurance. Remember though that if the intensity is too low you will not get the desired gains from ARCing. You must raise the blood pressure in your forearms in order to get a training stimilus. 15 - 20 minues on a slab won't do this. This is similar to what someone was saying earlier about ARCing on 5.7 and 5.8 and not feeling anything or getting any benefits, of course you won't get any benefits if the intensity is too low, for your current level.
In your case start with ARCs that last 10 - 15 minutes and build up your duration from there. In addition, you want to spend as much time on vertical climbing as you can, when you feel a slight pump coming on, get on the steepest slab you can and recover a bit, then go back tot he vertical climbing. This is not ideal but by doing this you can work up to spending longer and longer periods of time on the vertical sections, until you can go for 30 minutes on vertical climbing. This may take months to achieve, but if your endurance level is as low as you say it is, the impact on your climbing will be significant.
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sidepull
May 22, 2005, 10:53 PM
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Great response fluxus.
Your post made me wonder though, I see myself primarily as a boulderer. Because that's my discipline of focus, maybe shorter ARC sessions make more sense because 5 minutes on a hang board is way longer than I'd ever spend on an individual problem.
In addition, I guess I'm wondering if 30 minute ARC sessions are built more for competition climbers. PRC really has a big slant toward competition and those climbers need the endurance for scanning and locking off.
That said, I know that my endurance has limited my improvement. I think my climbing accomplishments are pretty decent, I boulder V7 and I've redpointed 5.12's. My body is pretty skinny and taller so endurance has never suited me. I'd take a 5.12 with a stiff bouldery crux over 5.10 Indian Creek route any day.
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fluxus
May 22, 2005, 11:18 PM
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In reply to: Your post made me wonder though, I see myself primarily as a boulderer. Because that's my discipline of focus, maybe shorter ARC sessions make more sense because 5 minutes on a hang board is way longer than I'd ever spend on an individual problem. In addition, I guess I'm wondering if 30 minute ARC sessions are built more for competition climbers. I boulder V7 and I've redpointed 5.12's. My body is pretty skinny and taller so endurance has never suited me. I'd take a 5.12 with a stiff bouldery crux over 5.10 Indian Creek route any day.
From my point of view the question for boulderers is: Do you get pumped during a bouldering session and if so how long does it take to wear off?
For the boulderer the need for endurance has to do with recovery between problems not for the actual climbing, since any bouldering effort will be anaerobic in nature. Also there is a limit to how short your ARCs can be and still be effective. If your blood pressure is not up for a reasonable length of time then there won't be a stimilus for change. At least, that's how I understand it.
being tall and skinny should not have any negative effect on your endurance, ever seen a world class marathoner?
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sportrock
May 24, 2005, 8:59 PM
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In reply to: For the boulderer the need for endurance has to do with recovery between problems not for the actual climbing, since any bouldering effort will be anaerobic in nature. Also there is a limit to how short your ARCs can be and still be effective. If your blood pressure is not up for a reasonable length of time then there won't be a stimilus for change. At least, that's how I understand it.
Folks, I'm afraid Fluxus is holding back here. Maybe too many demands from the cutting room and editors. He has extensive experience with a particular exercise relelvant to improving recovery between attempts and at the end of this post I'll ask him to elaborate on that activity and hope he has time to respond.
Bouldering is not an endurance (aerobic or anaerobic) based activity. Effort is confined to very short durations and failure usually occurs before any lactate accumulates or pump registers. Therefore endurance acitivities are of limited use in improving bouldering performance; however, I believe that in discussing recovery between problems we are dealing with an endurance of sorts referred to as stamina. I define stamina specifically the ability to repeatedly recover quickly and fully between attempts.
What exercises are most effective at improving stamina? Typically two are used: bouldering pyramids and continuous repetition training. Bouldering pyramids consist of 15 different problems: One at your maximum redpoint grade (for example V6), two at the next lowest grade (V5), four at the next lowest grade (V4) and eight at the lowest level (V3). In our example you would complete four problems at V3, then two at V4, one at V5, and the V6 before repeating the sequence in reverse order (1XV5, 2XV4, 4XV3). Use 15 different problems and do them in order, up one side of the pyramid and down the other. Take as much rest as you want between attempts and/or problems. Both Fluxus and I have good success improving stamina with this exercise.
Fluxus has more experience with CIR so if I might impose on his expertise to describe the acitvity...
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jw11733
Aug 15, 2005, 4:57 PM
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After reading this thread, I am quite interested in adding some ARC training to my regimin. Since I have a limited number of days I can climb per week (two), and a long daily commute (1 hour each way), I am wondering if supplemental ARC training is possible. I realize that the various grip training/squeeze type devices are not sport-specific enough to have much benefit as far as strength gains are concerned, but could a very easy type of device be of any use for ARC training? Since I could do 2 workouts a day (to and from work), and ARCing is very low impact, could there be a disadvantage to experimenting with this?
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jto
Oct 28, 2005, 7:38 PM
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I had to pick this one up... such a great thread. Quite rare in forums overall...
Question for fluxus and mates:
What do you think of Neil Greshams ideas on power endurance? I mean the two basic examples of progressiveness:
(Weekly progression, grades hypothetical but indicating something around onsight level. Of course this should be quite an excact number, but anyway the idea is to barely make the given sets so in the end of a session one should be quite trashed.)
A
1. 8*7a / 5ī pause
2. 10*7a / 5ī
3. 12*7a / 5ī
4. 12*7a / 4ī30"
5. 12*7a / 4ī
B
1. 10*7a / 5ī
2. 10*7a / 4ī
3. 10*7a+ / 5ī
4. 10*7a+ / 4ī
If we think one has done a good basic training in ARC, hypertrophy and recruitment...
- Which one of the systems in your opinion would work better in building up power endurance?
- What kind of problems one can have when committing to these systems?
- How long should one take it easier after those 4-5 weeks before the trip and what kind of training do you usually recommend for that easier phase?
- Would it be wise to keep up the power during the power endurance phase too (hard bouldering, campus etc.)?
Phew, that was a lot... but thanks for answers. Iīm new here and always so interested in discussing training matters and coaching (as it is my job too). Anyway climbing isnīt my long time specialty so Iīm not shy to ask other peoples opinions about stuff even if I wouldnīt agree with them.
Thanks for a great forum! :D
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sidepull
Oct 28, 2005, 8:55 PM
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It seems that we rarely link up the training with accomplishments. Mike (rockprodigy) has provided a signficant amount of info on this thread and he's also proved that it pays to train smart (i.e. periodize):
http://climbing.com/news/ziondunnroute/
Congrats Mike!
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fluxus
Oct 28, 2005, 10:03 PM
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In reply to: I mean the two basic examples of progressiveness: (Weekly progression, grades hypothetical but indicating something around onsight level. Of course this should be quite an excact number, but anyway the idea is to barely make the given sets so in the end of a session one should be quite trashed.) A 1. 8*7a / 5ī pause 2. 10*7a / 5ī 3. 12*7a / 5ī 4. 12*7a / 4ī30" 5. 12*7a / 4ī B 1. 10*7a / 5ī 2. 10*7a / 4ī 3. 10*7a+ / 5ī 4. 10*7a+ / 4ī
Sorry, I have no idea what you are trying to represent here under A and B.
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jto
Oct 29, 2005, 3:23 PM
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:lol: the ocean between us seems to have some effects...
ok... Iīll try to clarify things a bit:
system A
week 1: 8 times 7a sport route with 5 minutes pause between attempts
2: 10*7a / 5ī
3: 12*7a / 5ī
4: 12*7a / 4ī30"
5: 12*7a / 4ī
system B
1: 10*7a / 5ī
2: 10*7a / 4ī
3: 10*7a+ / 5ī
4: 10*7a+ / 4ī
got more sense out of me yet? :)
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fluxus
Oct 31, 2005, 6:21 PM
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In reply to: :lol: the ocean between us seems to have some effects... ok... Iīll try to clarify things a bit: system A week 1: 8 times 7a sport route with 5 minutes pause between attempts 2: 10*7a / 5ī 3: 12*7a / 5ī 4: 12*7a / 4ī30" 5: 12*7a / 4ī system B 1: 10*7a / 5ī 2: 10*7a / 4ī 3: 10*7a+ / 5ī 4: 10*7a+ / 4ī got more sense out of me yet? :)
Thanks, yes that is more clear.
In theory this would be just fine for what I would call a low intensity Anaerobic Endurance workout. two thoughts:
1) 5 Minutes is, a long rest between attempts so it implies that the route is very hard for the climber, but if that is the case, they would not be able to complete 8 or more repetitions. This being the case, I'm gonna guess that the route is not going to be all that hard for the climber in question, and that this is intended as a moderate to low intensitiy workout, which is fine, specifically for those wanting to train AE for on-sight or competition climbing.
2) I notice that there is no target time for the repetitions. This is a mistake. Its important to keep each lap within a specific target duration. If you don't, what happens is the climber gets faster and faster with each lap. I've seen people start out taking 3 minutes to do a lap, and over the course of the workout cut that time down to 1:30. The problem with this is that it dramatically reduces the training stimilus and it allows the climber to climb at a pace that they would never use in a performance. This means the motor density of the workout is dramatically different from that of the performance, which will greatly reduce the workout's effectivness.
3) This workout would be most effective if it were not done as laps on one route. If there were a a number of routes at the grade next to each other and the climber had to do 4 - 8 different routes. This would keep their work durations longer, and prevent them from relying on having mastered one sequence.
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fluxus
Oct 31, 2005, 6:28 PM
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In reply to: :lol: the ocean between us seems to have some effects... ok... Iīll try to clarify things a bit: system A week 1: 8 times 7a sport route with 5 minutes pause between attempts 2: 10*7a / 5ī 3: 12*7a / 5ī 4: 12*7a / 4ī30" 5: 12*7a / 4ī system B 1: 10*7a / 5ī 2: 10*7a / 4ī 3: 10*7a+ / 5ī 4: 10*7a+ / 4ī got more sense out of me yet? :)
Thanks, yes that is more clear.
In theory this would be just fine for what I would call a low intensity Anaerobic Endurance workout. Four thoughts:
1) 5 Minutes is, a long rest between attempts so it implies that the route is very hard for the climber, but if that is the case, they would not be able to complete 8 or more repetitions. This being the case, I'm gonna guess that the route is not going to be all that hard for the climber in question, and that this is intended as a moderate to low intensitiy workout, which is fine, specifically for those wanting to train AE for on-sight or competition climbing.
2) I notice that there is no target time for the repetitions. This is a mistake. Its important to keep each lap within a specific target duration. If you don't, what happens is the climber gets faster and faster with each lap. I've seen people start out taking 3 minutes to do a lap, and over the course of the workout cut that time down to 1:30. The problem with this is that it dramatically reduces the training stimilus and it allows the climber to climb at a pace that they would never use in a performance. This means the motor density of the workout is dramatically different from that of the performance, which will greatly reduce the workout's effectivness.
3) I would think that the progression would also have a significant impact on the climber's stamina, since with long rests and large number of repetitions its almost a repetition workout rather than an interval workout.
4) This workout would be most effective if it were not done as laps on just one route. If there were a a number of routes at the grade next to each other and the climber had to do 4 - 8 different routes. This would keep their work durations longer, and prevent them from relying on having mastered one sequence.
5) For the climber interested in red pointing a wide variety of routes espically those shorter routes like those found in American Fork and other well known short steep "kick in the pants" areas the progression above should be combined with some sort of high intensity workout that has short work durations, short rests and a smaller number of repetitions.
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jto
Oct 31, 2005, 8:36 PM
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Thanks for comments and again for a great forum.
To make the above Mr. Greshams systems better to suit a person who is letīs say preparing for a sport climbing road trip, what changes would you recommend?
I came up with this five week sketch:
week 1: 5 times onsight level route of 22 moves, pause 4 minutes
week 2: 6 times onsight level route of 24 moves, pause 4 minutes
week 3: 7 times onsight level route of 28 moves, pause 4 minutes
week 4: 7 times onsight level route of 30 moves, pause 3 minutes 30 seconds
week 5: 7 times onsight level route of 30 moves, pause 3 minutes
week 6: no hard AE, one strength and power, one ARC
week 7: hard climbing and grade smashing on a road trip :)
In all the AE routes the target time would be kept at 5-10 seconds per move even if the climbing gets easier. There would be 2-3 different routes where the training is done and the same route wouldnīt be done back to back.
Weekly schedule would go
Mo: Strength and power bouldering
Tu: rest
We: AE workout, faster pace (5 secs per move)
Th: ARC
Fr: rest
Sa: AE workout, slower pace (10 secs per move)
Su: rest
If we are talking about the main principles of AE period, what would they be in your opinion?
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fluxus
Oct 31, 2005, 10:24 PM
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In reply to: To make the above Mr. Greshams systems better to suit a person who is letīs say preparing for a sport climbing road trip, what changes would you recommend? I came up with this five week sketch: week 1: 5 times onsight level route of 22 moves, pause 4 minutes week 2: 6 times onsight level route of 24 moves, pause 4 minutes week 3: 7 times onsight level route of 28 moves, pause 4 minutes week 4: 7 times onsight level route of 30 moves, pause 3 minutes 30 seconds week 5: 7 times onsight level route of 30 moves, pause 3 minutes week 6: no hard AE, one strength and power, one ARC week 7: hard climbing and grade smashing on a road trip :) In all the AE routes the target time would be kept at 5-10 seconds per move even if the climbing gets easier. There would be 2-3 different routes where the training is done and the same route wouldnīt be done back to back. Weekly schedule would go Mo: Strength and power bouldering Tu: rest We: AE workout, faster pace (5 secs per move) Th: ARC Fr: rest Sa: AE workout, slower pace (10 secs per move) Su: rest
Here are a couple of tweeks to consider:
1- You set target paces of 5 and 10 secs per move, I suspect that you will find this pretty difficult to do. Rather than pacing per move set a realistic target duration for the entire route. To do this, do one of the routes as a warm-up on lead, and climb at your normal pace. How long this takes you is a good target duration.
When doing your AE don't bother measuring the number of moves. I know its popular, but our muscles don't respond to the number of moves that we have done, they respond to the intensity and duration of the work they are asked to do, which means setting a target duration for each lap. Use routes long enough that it takes you over 2:30 to 3 min to do each lap, and up to 5:30min per lap if you are more of an onsight climber.
2- Do some higher intensity AE training either by doing bouldering circuits or shorter workouts on harder routes. for example doing 4-5 laps on a steep route that is 2 letter grades above your onsight level with a rest of 2 -3 minutes between laps.
3- You may want to include more ARCing since you won't be able to increase your anaerobic threshold on one day of ARCing per week.
OR
If your road trip consists of mostly red pointing short hard sport routes, don't worry about it. Its not because I think endurance is unimportant but because it would take a long time to get your ARC level high enough to effect your performance on this kind of routes. In other words getting the anaerobic threshold of your forearm muscles sky high is a long tem project that will take 3 - 4 or more months, not something to undertake 6 weeks prior to a road trip.
4- don't let the number of reps. in your AE workouts be written in stone. You've dropped the number of reps per workout a bit from your first post, but if you finish rep # 7 and feel like you can do more, add another rep or two.
5- There is a fair amount of rest in your schedule, but be open to the idea that you may need more. The long AE session may take 2 or more days to recover from.
6- in your bouldering, keep track of what you are doing, don't just throw yourself at the hardest problems, do most of your bouldering at the level at which you are successful in 2 - 5 tries and get a high volume of bouldering in during each session.
7- If you don't already keep a training log start keeping one. You are doing a lot of work, and you want to be able to quantify your training in relation to your performance on the road trip. You won't be able to evaluate how well you did unless you have a good record of your training and a good record of your performance. Maybe post it all as a thread here in RC.com so people can learn from your example.
In reply to: If we are talking about the main principles of AE period, what would they be in your opinion?
maybe I'll get to this one later.
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jto
Nov 1, 2005, 9:23 AM
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Thanks mate. Interesting pointers. My sketch was all that: a sketch, so it was perhaps easier to suggets changes than to start from zero. The time pace was maybe a suggestion more than a rule as I would like to train slower climbing more for my onsights. If I set only a time limit I might rush the harder parts and then slow down only on the easier part. Anyway I got your point.
What do you think about the rest periods compared to the work? Should it be 1:1 or less? Is it a good idea to cut down the rest period as the phase goes on as in my sketch?
I agree on the amount of ARCīs. I usually develope endurance quite quickly even if it sounds strange. For example if I toprope a hard route (done in ~10 tries) I can do it four times in a row (pause only what it takes to lower me down) within a few weeks. Anyway I think youīre right and two ARCīs a week wouldnīt hurt. I think thatīs enough though if Iīll try to do 2 AEīs and at least one boulder session a week too. Of course week is nothing. The cycle can be 8-9 days or what ever.
I also agree with the harder AE workouts to be included. As the wall we train the routes on is only 10-15 degrees overhanging (12metres high) itīs hard to simulate steep stuff there. I have a 50 degree boulder woodie at my house and been doing longer porblems there for AE. I might build a problem that has 10-15 pretty hard moves. In the beginning I do it 3-4 times with 5 mins rest. I try to work on it once a week and in two months I can do maybe 5-6 times 15-20 moves with 4 minutes rest. Sounds bad? Anyway I think increasing the time spent on the problem is good and not always just to make the problem harder. That is supposed to be not like an AE phase itself but rather a maintaining (and slow progress) of the AE during other phases.
Iīm mainly an onsighter on roadtrips but would like to do a bit redpointing too. Maybe the first day RPīs and the second OSīs and after that a rest day. Even I have lost 60 pounds when moved from powerlifting to climbing I still have pretty much difficulties moving my 185 pound self on the huge overhangs. Thereīs a lot of work to do...
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microbarn
Nov 1, 2005, 3:01 PM
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In reply to: Iīm mainly an onsighter on roadtrips but would like to do a bit redpointing too. Maybe the first day RPīs and the second OSīs and after that a rest day.
If you are going to do this it seems to make more sense to reverse those days. Try to onsight everything the first day. What doesn't get onsighted the first day is then a red point project for the second day.
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jto
Nov 1, 2005, 6:37 PM
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logically it would be better to do it like that. onsight climbing is slower and that way demanding.
The idea behind this order is that I have never redpointed in the true sense of the word and I thought I could concentrate more on hard work on the first day and take it a bit easier the next.
Anyway I think I could do it also like this when on a two week trip (grades hypothetical):
1. hard onsighting 7a/+
2. redpointing (the ones I couldnīt do yesterday) 7a/+
3. rest
4. project redpointing (harder route than on day two) 7b/+
5. onsighting (more volume but easier than day one) 6c - 7a
6. rest
7. hard onsighting 7a+
8. redpointing (the ones I couldnīt do yesterday) 7a+
9. rest
10. project redpointing (harder route than on day four if I did it) 7b+
11. onsighting (more volume but easier than day one) 6c - 7a
12. rest
13. hard onsighting 7a+ -7b
14. rest
15. project redpointing(harder/other route than on day ten if I did it) 7b+/c
I think Iīll pick a project or two in the beginning and work on them on days 4, 10 and 15. The rest of the climbing would be done pretty much like "looks great, letīs climb it!". Maybe the hard onsighting could also be a bit more planned.
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microbarn
Nov 1, 2005, 6:51 PM
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I like your current lay out. I personally would not be able to climb that hard for as many days as you laid out. I would have to add in another day of break probably before or after your item 5. Then, I would have to add in another day or two throughout the rest. However, everyone has different abilities.
Despite the difference in resting, I really like your lay out and might steal it for myself.
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jto
Nov 1, 2005, 6:59 PM
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Cheers, you do that and hopefully have it work for you :D
I can usually climb 3-4 days in a row pretty hard on limestone as it seems the skin in my fingers is the most limiting factor. Here in Finland where I live the absolute max is two days in a row. The rock is great but granite is sooo much different from the soft and tender arms of the limestone :)
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fluxus
Nov 1, 2005, 7:52 PM
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In reply to: What do you think about the rest periods compared to the work? Should it be 1:1 or less? Is it a good idea to cut down the rest period as the phase goes on as in my sketch?
I usually start people out at 1:1 just as a starting place, if its too little take more, if its too much cut back on the rest. Cutting down the rest while increasing the number of reps. or difficulty may work or it may not. The answer to the question is specific to you, and the routes you are using. I don't have a general opposition to it.
In reply to: I also agree with the harder AE workouts to be included. As the wall we train the routes on is only 10-15 degrees overhanging (12metres high) itīs hard to simulate steep stuff there. I have a 50 degree boulder woodie at my house and been doing longer porblems there for AE. I might build a problem that has 10-15 pretty hard moves. In the beginning I do it 3-4 times with 5 mins rest. I try to work on it once a week and in two months I can do maybe 5-6 times 15-20 moves with 4 minutes rest. Sounds bad? Anyway I think increasing the time spent on the problem is good and not always just to make the problem harder.
Rather than making one problem that you do 3 - 4 times, create 4 problems and do these problems back to back with no rest and call that a set. Do 4 sets with 3 - 4 min. rest between sets. This is a 4X4. When working on your home woodie for AE I would suggest puting the emphaisis on the difficulty of the moves rather than on increasing duration. Keep your sets to 2:30 in duration and increase the difficulity of the problems as you improve.
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jto
Nov 1, 2005, 8:24 PM
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thanks. gotta put those 4x4 and 4x6 systems to the test the next time Iīll get into AE phase.
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jto
Nov 9, 2005, 4:19 PM
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Registered: Sep 18, 2004
Posts: 272
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As so many others me too am waiting for your book to come out... while waiting, letīs keep a good thread alive.
What do you think about the basic principles of power endurance phase for sport climbing? Of course everything is dependant of training backgrounds, route profiles (short powerful or long sustained) etc. but Iīm interested in the general picture.
1. How long should the phase be and what should one keep in mind when adjusting the phase length?
2. Should one add more volume over the period or up the grade? I mean which one is better (grades showing just to clear things out):
- 6 times 7b ( letīs say onsight level) , 5 minute pauses progressing to 10 times 7b, 4 minute pauses or
- 6 times 7b, 5 minute pauses progressing to 6x7b+, 5 minute pauses.
3. How should the workout load be calculated? How many sets would do it and should one be completely trashed in the end or leave something for the next time?
4. How many times should one do anaerobic endurance in a week? Should the strength, power and ARC be kept along at maintenance level?
5. Is it better to do the same grade many times or lower the grade as one is getting more tired:
- 6x7b or
- 7b+, 7b, 7a+, 7a, 6c+, 6c
(About the latter system: My friend does about all the power endurance under an open staircase: max distance going up and down using 2cm edge followed immediately a max distance using 4cm edge followed immedaitely a max distance using the whole hand edge. He did 8b in two and a half years after he started climbing, so somethings done right.)
6. Should one cut down the rest periods when the phase goes on and if one should, how much? If one starts at 1:1 (letīs say work period is 3 minutes), what is the other end? Work 3 minutes, rest 1 minute?
7. You said before that if one is concentrating more in onsighting, the work period should over 5 minutes. Should one also climb slower and simulate onsight climbing that way?
Thatīs a lot and Iīm sorry if thereīs things that make you repeat yourself but the subject is very interesting.
Thanks a lot :)
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jto
Nov 9, 2005, 4:26 PM
Post #99 of 127
(48550 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 18, 2004
Posts: 272
|
As so many others me too am waiting for your book to come out... while waiting, letīs keep a good thread alive.
What do you think about the basic principles of power endurance phase for sport climbing? Of course everything is dependant of training backgrounds, route profiles (short powerful or long sustained) etc. but Iīm interested in the general picture.
1. How long should the phase be and what should one keep in mind when adjusting the phase length?
2. Should one add more volume over the period or up the grade? I mean which one is better (grades showing just to clarify):
- 6 times 7b ( letīs say onsight level) , 5 minute pauses progressing to 10 times 7a, 4 minute pauses or
- 6 times 7b, 5 minute pauses progressing to 6x7b+, 5 minute pauses.
3. How should the workout load be calculated? How many sets would do it and should one be completely trashed in the end or leave something for the next time?
4. How many times should one do anaerobic endurance in a week? Should the strength, power and ARC be kept along at maintenance level?
5. Is it better to do the same grade many times or lower the grade as one is getting more tired:
- 6x7b or
- 7b+, 7b, 7a+, 7a, 6c+, 6c
(My friend does about all the power endurance under an open staircase: max distance going up and down using 2cm edge followed by max distance using 4cm edge followed by max distance using the whole hand edge. He did 8b in two and a half years after he started climbing.)
6. Should one cut down the rest periods when the phase goes on and if one should, how much? If one starts at 1:1 (letīs say work period is 3 minutes), what is the other end? Work 3 minutes, rest 1 minute?
7. You said before that if one is concentrating more in onsighting, the work period should over 5 minutes. Should one also climb slower and simulate onsight climbing that way?
Thatīs a lot and Iīm sorry if thereīs things that make you repeat yourself but the subject is very interesting.
Thanks a lot :)
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jto
Nov 21, 2005, 3:26 PM
Post #100 of 127
(48550 views)
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Registered: Sep 18, 2004
Posts: 272
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I would go on and answer the questions myself but Iīm not an expert when it comes to this kind of training for climbing.
If someone (fluxus seems like having a good know how) could, please answer. Iīm sure these things are not so clear to everybody :)
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