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Muad_Dib
Dec 28, 2007, 6:24 PM
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I read about this on the internet last night and some things about it sound interesting but the sites with the info are highly biased, i.e wight lifting & supplement sites. Does anyone know anything about this steroid? Anyone used it or know someone who has?
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verdon_forever
Dec 28, 2007, 6:38 PM
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It's considered as a performance enhancing drug banned in sports, although sold legally without prescription in the U.S.
Even if it's considered as a prohormone of testosterone, I personally wouldn't touch any of that stuff and would advise you to do the same.
Furthermore we are talking about rockclimbing here, you don't need that kind of supplement. Your body produces enough of it. Just go train!
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dazed
Dec 28, 2007, 10:52 PM
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Muad_Dib wrote: I read about this on the internet last night and some things about it sound interesting but the sites with the info are highly biased, i.e wight lifting & supplement sites. Does anyone know anything about this steroid? Anyone used it or know someone who has?
Usually I observe these boards from a distance, but you are in way over your head, and this thread has been pretty quiet...
4 andro is what you said, a steroid. Although it is very helpful for weight lifters, it is a lousy supplement for climbers.
While climbing on andro the only benefit will be increased aggression allowing you to climb harder. While some strength may be gained, little weight will be gained as you will not be causing any breakdown of muscle fibers. Your muscles may gain strength, however, your connective tissue will not gain enough strength in proportion to the muscular strength gains. Thus you increase your risk of injury. Any muscle weight you do gain is more unnecessary weight to haul to the top. Thus one negates the possible benefits of taking such a substance.
Andro requires the use of an anti-estrogen at the end of the steroid cycle. While on Andro, ones natural testosterone production is suppressed by the presense of synthetic testosterone. If an anti-estrogen is not used, it takes a long time for one to restart production of natural testosterone. This may lead to significant atrophy. Additionally, if an anti estrogen is not taken, there will be a severe imbalance of testosterone to estrogen, leading so side effects such as "bitchtits" or the formation of breast tissue in males.
If you are still considering doing this, you need to do a lot more research. One will find that there are many better and safer drugs than 4AD. One should become familiar with all the possible effects and proper procedure for use. The use of steroids is not to be taken lightly. I hope that if you choose to use synthetic testosterone that you inform your self so that you don't get in over your head. Research, research,research!
Dazed
(This post was edited by dazed on Dec 28, 2007, 10:53 PM)
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Muad_Dib
Dec 28, 2007, 11:36 PM
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I'm not looking to take this personally just thought it sounded interesting. Thanks for the info, very helpful. sounds like steroids for climbers is prolly not the best idea. i mean how you gonna send those run outs with such tiny balls?
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boulderkitty
Dec 29, 2007, 1:06 AM
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Don't use steroids. They're bad for you.
(This post was edited by boulderkitty on Dec 29, 2007, 1:08 AM)
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Hennessey
Dec 29, 2007, 3:46 AM
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Don't even bother with that shit.
The cons outway pros of steroids too heavily.
I work with a buch of roid heads.You don't know the meaning of roid rage until you see someone transform from a perfectly nice person into a complete fucking asshole. One second your buddy-buddy joking around the next second there trying to tear your head off.
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pro_alien
Dec 29, 2007, 5:23 PM
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Not a steroid but a prohormone.
Banned in the US since January 2005.
(This post was edited by pro_alien on Dec 29, 2007, 6:21 PM)
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reno
Dec 29, 2007, 5:40 PM
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boulderkitty wrote: Don't use steroids. They're bad for you.
Reminds me of a female weightlifter who went to her doctor a few weeks after the trainer started her on steroids:
"Doc, I've got two things I want to talk to you about. The first is that I've noticed some pretty abnormal hair growth, and I think it could be a side effect of the steroids."
"That's a reasonable concern. Where is this hair growth you mention?"
"On my balls. And that's the second thing I wanted to talk about."
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csproul
Dec 29, 2007, 5:52 PM
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pro_alien wrote: Not a steroid but a prohormone. Banned in the US since January 1995.
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squarf
Dec 29, 2007, 6:07 PM
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Seriously why do people try and take the easy way out?
If you want to enhance your performance... start getting really anal retentive about what you eat. Only put in the highest quality of food (in the proper amounts-- to find this out, study nutrition). Make sure you take every vitamin you can think of, but making sure not to take more than is recommended (look at the %'s on the back of the bottle and make sure it corresponds with your diet-- again, study nutrition). Get a few books about training, and follow ALL of their advice (including when to rest). On those days off work vigorously (5-6 hours daily) on your balance, coordination, and core strength with non-climbing activities. Make sure to get 8-9 hours of solid sleep a night. Make sure to do ALL of your training outside, on different types of rock (even if it includes a 6 hour car ride each way daily). Then after doing this for 10-12 years... if you haven't improved even a little bit after that time period... Maybe you should CONSIDER speaking with a physician (which would be someone who understands the human body... a requirement when seeking advice on what to put IN your body) about the use of steroids.
In short:
Become a nutritionist
Become a workout guru
Climb 4 times/week on different types of rock
Maintain for 10-12 years
Get shot down about the idea of roids by a Dr.
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pro_alien
Dec 29, 2007, 6:21 PM
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csproul wrote: I'm no chemist, but I am pretty sure that it is a steroid. It looks like an androstane, which is a 19 carbon atom containing steroid, and is a prohormone (is converted to) for testosterone.
It is called a prohormone because it gets converted by the body to testosterone. That is how they got away with selling the stuff in the first place...
Compared with the real thing (steroids), side effects from prohormones should be pretty mild for men.
I mistyped, banned since January 2005.
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csproul
Dec 29, 2007, 6:27 PM
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pro_alien wrote: csproul wrote: I'm no chemist, but I am pretty sure that it is a steroid. It looks like an androstane, which is a 19 carbon atom containing steroid, and is a prohormone (is converted to) for testosterone. It is called a prohormone because it gets converted by the body to testosterone. That is how they got away with selling the stuff in the first place... Compared with the real thing (steroids), side effects from prohormones should be pretty mild for men. I mistyped, banned since January 2005.
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pro_alien
Dec 29, 2007, 7:25 PM
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In reply to: Yes that is the definition of a prohormone, but it is a steroid. A steroid merely refers to the chemical structure, a terpenoid lipid containing four fused rings. It is not a steroid hormone, but is a steroid prohormone.
I stand corrected.
For climbers, there is no need anyway. You should be able to develop enough strength without messing with your hormonal balance *. Then there is also technique, as evidenced by the testosterone-deprived women that outclimb me or the original poster by a wide margin...
* adding estrogen to women is called hormone replacement therapy and widely promoted, adding testosterone to men is called doping and illegal - go figure.
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