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Ains


Nov 24, 2008, 3:14 AM
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think of your gut as a power source. Doesn't seem so bad now does it?Cherish the gut. No but seriously, just get stronger, not everyone can have flat abs. Remember what Peyton Manning says: "lets face it, unless your 22 years old or a professional football player your probably not gonna get 6-pack abs". I know a guy with a nice sized gut and he pulls wicked hard.


Valarc


Nov 24, 2008, 3:39 AM
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shockabuku wrote:
Valarc wrote:
my unhealthy PA upbringing (I crave AP cakes and cheesesteaks like nobody's business

My mom just came to visit. She brought Good's potato chips (potatoes and salt cooked in lard), and Tastycakes. Just what I need.

I was always more of an Utz fan than Good's...

Damn, now not only am I a fatass, I'm a hungry fatass. Curse you RC.com!


Hennessey


Nov 24, 2008, 3:42 AM
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Re: [armsrforclimbing] How to get rid of this gut [In reply to]
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armsrforclimbing wrote:
Get on the P90X train!!!!!

Those videos are intense. It dosen't matter how in shape you, you will still be sore the next several days after one of those workouts.


wk127001


Nov 24, 2008, 4:04 AM
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Depending on how strong willed you are, you could try not drinking. But coming from someone who lost 20 pounds this summer, to do it right, it will take about 4-6 months.


Sarah_Sunshine


Nov 24, 2008, 4:27 AM
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Pilates is all about your core. Buy a video (read the back to make sure you don't need equipment you don't have), or go to the gym and surround yourself with ladies. You may be one of the few guys or the only guy in the class. Enjoy!


bothomsen


Nov 24, 2008, 4:27 AM
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eat some around 1,3 lbs. of vegetables every day.
half at lunch the rest at dinner. skip most carbs - like bread, pasta and potatoes. and ofcourse sugar containing drinks(soda's) and alcohol.

try do one month with out eating out, only eat what you cook at home! and allways bring a bottle of wather with you, and som carots or likes. in case you get hungry.
dont eat until you are full!


Hennessey


Nov 24, 2008, 4:37 AM
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bothomsen wrote:
eat some around 1,3 lbs. of vegetables every day.
half at lunch the rest at dinner. skip most carbs - like bread, pasta and potatoes. and ofcourse sugar containing drinks(soda's) and alcohol.

No alcohol. What the hell is the world coming to. I'd rather have the gut


adatesman


Nov 24, 2008, 4:38 AM
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Hennessey


Nov 24, 2008, 4:47 AM
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"adatesman wrote:
Funny thing.... I was a bit over 200 when I left Michigan and within 6 months of being back in Philly I had dropped to 175 on a steady diet of pizza, cheesesteaks and beer. So clearly any extra extra weight you're carrying is due to lack of what your body has been genetically developed to need in order for proper functioning..... Wink

Ahhhh pizza, cheesesteaks and beer. The diet of a true Philadelphian


Valarc


Nov 24, 2008, 6:04 AM
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adatesman wrote:
within 6 months of being back in Philly I had dropped to 175 on a steady diet of pizza, cheesesteaks and beer. So clearly any extra extra weight you're carrying is due to lack of what your body has been genetically developed to need in order for proper functioning..... Wink

I think it's more likely that you LOST the ability to actually digest the horrid greasy slop that we called food in philadelphia, so it went right through you, depriving your body of nutrients and forcing it to burn fat in order to survive.

In one end, out the other... just happens a lot faster when it's greased up with a few cheesteaks and some Yeungling. It's like an intestinal slip-n-slide.


rtwilli4


Nov 24, 2008, 7:50 AM
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you'd be surprised at what running and swimming will do for your core. It's not gonna make your abs more powerful but it will help you trim down. Also... specific core workouts such as hanging leg (or knee) raises will help but to lose the fat you have to be able to do dozens pretty fast.

I used to fight a lot and to strengthen my core I would take a 45 lb plate and hold it close to my chest. With my feet spread significantly wider than my shoulders I would rotate my shoulders from left to right, right to left, left to right, and so on; twisting my core almost to the max. Do this fast but not violently. If you need more weight but can't get a heavier plate, move your feet closer together. You don't have to use a weight, it can be anything heavy that you can hold on to.

Then there are always crunches.

Diet is important. Lots protein... maybe 100g a day. I'd say around 60 to 65 percent of your caloric intake should be carbs... stop drinking so much beer... try not to eat late at night... all the normal stuff.

EDIT: I dunno why I said 60 to 65 % per day... it should probably be less than that if you are trying to lose weight. However... if you eat properly and work out then 60% is probably ok.


(This post was edited by rtwilli4 on Nov 25, 2008, 12:21 AM)


derk424


Nov 24, 2008, 7:33 PM
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From my experience of weight loss,this past summer i weighed 190 now i weigh 158 as of this morning and have gained a ridiculous amount of muscle compared to before. However the key to so much progress was a slow process yeah there was an initial 10lbs drop when i changed my eating habits but i plateaud several times once at 170, 165 and recently 160. The difference is although im not losing weight im losing fat slowly, which is key.
U dont want an instant drop, you will not lose your gut in that manner. Its a slow process, i spent alot of time reading up on best ways to burn fat. the method i found most effective is to start doing interval training. in other word high intensity with small burst of low intensity rest. the reson being is the constant change of intensity sends ur metabolism into shock, forcing it to overwork for up to 48 hours post workout.

just my 2 cents good luck sir!


Hennessey


Nov 24, 2008, 10:32 PM
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derk424 wrote:
From my experience of weight loss,this past summer i weighed 190 now i weigh 158 as of this morning and have gained a ridiculous amount of muscle compared to before. However the key to so much progress was a slow process yeah there was an initial 10lbs drop when i changed my eating habits but i plateaud several times once at 170, 165 and recently 160. The difference is although im not losing weight im losing fat slowly, which is key.
U dont want an instant drop, you will not lose your gut in that manner. Its a slow process, i spent alot of time reading up on best ways to burn fat. the method i found most effective is to start doing interval training. in other word high intensity with small burst of low intensity rest. the reson being is the constant change of intensity sends ur metabolism into shock, forcing it to overwork for up to 48 hours post workout.

just my 2 cents good luck sir!

Thats a good 2 cents

But it's reason


derk424


Nov 25, 2008, 12:22 AM
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spelling nazi haha(also spelled as laugh in case you want to get technical)


aerili


Nov 25, 2008, 5:29 AM
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WTF. Why do I hear all this shit about doing Pilates for your gut, doing swimming instead of some other aerobic exercise b/c it will "work your core [aka beer gut] more", and all other manner of core-specific workouts?

Do you guys honestly still believe in spot reduction???

Rule #1: don't give advice on weight loss when you have no idea what you are talking about--and when, in fact, you still subscribe to pseudoscience of years gone by.


aerili


Nov 25, 2008, 5:35 AM
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Hi bbowers,
I trained various kinds of people for a number of years. I preferred to train athletes for sport reasons, but I also worked with lots of people who needed to lose weight as well as gain weight over this time. (I should mention I have appropriate credentials in this area as well that include a college degree.) Weight management and obesity issues are complex; even I don't understand everything.

That said, here is some general advice:

1. Android obesity (beer gut) is the most responsive fat storage to exercise, much more responsive than gynoid obesity (hips and thighs). Hopefully this encourages you.

2. Strenuous exercise that incorporates both aerobic and resistance training should elicit you the greatest gains if done properly and then maintained (typically less effortful) for the long haul.

3. By resistance training, I do not mean just bicep curls, abs, and bench chess or push ups.

4. The more variety you have in your aerobic exercise, the better. And really. When it comes down to it, who gives a fuck about swimming and your core or running and your core. The most important thing is to do the exercise you are most likely to do at all. Ultimately, though, you will need some variety in this area to overcome plateaus.

5. Do your aerobic exercise in HIT format if you can muster the intrinsic motivation. A number of studies are finding that High Intensity Training intervals appear to be more effective at burning fat than the typical Slow Moderate Pace to Nowhere that most people engage in. This is believed to be due to it causing elevated post-exercise oxygen consumption, but I won't get into that.

5a. High intensity intervals usually requires short bouts of pushing hard on your chosen activity. The duration of sprints is dependent on an individual athlete and what their aerobic requirements may be. I do anywhere from 30 sec-2 min usually. That is, my interval ends when I literally cannot push any longer at that pace at that time. I will warn you: the majority of people do not have the mental discipline or motivation to truly train HI intervals.

6. Although resting metabolic rate is only correlated at less than 20% dependent on skeletal muscle, clearly we know exercise, esp. strenuous exercise, has a profound effect on it anyway. Aerobic exercise alone typically has a correlation with a loss of muscle mass. This is bad. That is why I tell people to strength train. Not to mention I have personally witnessed far better results in my clients when they employ whole body strength training.

7. Which leads to my next point. Climber dudes who need to lose weight tend to try to go about it by only exercising half their body (the upper half). But you do need to preserve lean mass in your lower body, and as research shows, aerobic exercise doesn't do this. So strengthen your lower body; after all, it has the largest muscles in your body and can burn a whole lotta calories. Trust me, you can do this without getting huge legs which will weigh you down in climbing. Oh, and your knees will thank you for it eventually.

7. Yes, you MUST watch what you eat. BUT overly restrictive "dieting" can have very negative effects on your resting metabolic rate (i.e. it will decline), effects which studies show not even cardio or weight training will be able to reverse back up.

8. Do not deny yourself things completely. I have never told a client they cannot have this or that. Just areas where they need to cut back and/or employ other strategies. If you pig out one day, make sure you rein in the following two days to make up for it or do some extra exercise to help get into a calorie deficit. Also, avoid drinking your calories!

9. Accept that your problem areas will always be your problem areas, no matter how perfect your body eventually becomes on my advice. This is true for every person on earth. The battle will be eternal, and it will always be in the same place(s).

10. Lastly, most of rtwilli4's post was completely useless and/or nonsense. Please avoid reading it if you haven't already.

Sorry this was so long. This kind of stuff can't fit into a three-sentence post. Hope it helps a little!


knieveltech


Nov 25, 2008, 5:37 AM
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bbowers wrote:
I like to consider myself relatively in shape, as of this morning I weigh 196.3Lbs. I'm 5'10"... used to play soccer all my life until a mountain biking accident messed my knee up so I can't play.

I started climbing almost 2 years ago...currently my main weakness is my horrible days when my forearms pump out on the first climb. I try to pay attention to what I eat, but sometimes this forearm pump crap lasts a few days. I climb at the gym every other day.

Anyway on to whats bothering me.... I have a gut (I think anyway) I can vary my weight from 204lbs to around 175 by changing what I eat for a few days...but the gut is always there.

What do you do to get rid of your gut and get those abs exposed? I feel like getting rid of this extra baggage will get me that extra performance I need.

Henry Rollins wrote:
Eat less. Eat better. Move more.


Toast_in_the_Machine


Nov 25, 2008, 12:44 PM
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[aerili] has is good advice. Mine will be of a much lower quality.

I suggest working nothing but your chest and back muscles. It won’t help climbing; it won’t help spot reduce your gut; and it won’t burn many calories. However, if your chest is larger it will make your gut look proportionally smaller. It will still be there, but your shape will change and you’ll look better.

If you’re going to drink (and you know you are), do nothing but shots of vodka. Look, you’re drinking to get alcohol into your body, by doing shots only you’re reducing the number of excess calories that might slip in. Plus, you’ll sound tougher if that is all you drink.

Follow my advice and you’ll be a chest pounding, vodka shooting hard man in no time.


climbguy__1


Nov 25, 2008, 1:36 PM
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Heres what I am thinking.

Allot of people have an intollerance to either wheat or dairy. This can cause them to form a "gut" when the remainder of their body is in proportion.

I suggest cutting the evil dairy out or your life completely for a month and see how you feel after that. If that doesnt work, move on to the wheat option. Its a better way of life anyways, your body will thank you.


colatownkid


Nov 25, 2008, 2:11 PM
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aerili wrote:
Hi bbowers,
I trained various kinds of people for a number of years. I preferred to train athletes for sport reasons, but I also worked with lots of people who needed to lose weight as well as gain weight over this time. (I should mention I have appropriate credentials in this area as well that include a college degree.) Weight management and obesity issues are complex; even I don't understand everything.

That said, here is some general advice:

1. Android obesity (beer gut) is the most responsive fat storage to exercise, much more responsive than gynoid obesity (hips and thighs). Hopefully this encourages you.

2. Strenuous exercise that incorporates both aerobic and resistance training should elicit you the greatest gains if done properly and then maintained (typically less effortful) for the long haul.

3. By resistance training, I do not mean just bicep curls, abs, and bench chess or push ups.

4. The more variety you have in your aerobic exercise, the better. And really. When it comes down to it, who gives a fuck about swimming and your core or running and your core. The most important thing is to do the exercise you are most likely to do at all. Ultimately, though, you will need some variety in this area to overcome plateaus.

5. Do your aerobic exercise in HIT format if you can muster the intrinsic motivation. A number of studies are finding that High Intensity Training intervals appear to be more effective at burning fat than the typical Slow Moderate Pace to Nowhere that most people engage in. This is believed to be due to it causing elevated post-exercise oxygen consumption, but I won't get into that.

5a. High intensity intervals usually requires short bouts of pushing hard on your chosen activity. The duration of sprints is dependent on an individual athlete and what their aerobic requirements may be. I do anywhere from 30 sec-2 min usually. That is, my interval ends when I literally cannot push any longer at that pace at that time. I will warn you: the majority of people do not have the mental discipline or motivation to truly train HI intervals.

6. Although resting metabolic rate is only correlated at less than 20% dependent on skeletal muscle, clearly we know exercise, esp. strenuous exercise, has a profound effect on it anyway. Aerobic exercise alone typically has a correlation with a loss of muscle mass. This is bad. That is why I tell people to strength train. Not to mention I have personally witnessed far better results in my clients when they employ whole body strength training.

7. Which leads to my next point. Climber dudes who need to lose weight tend to try to go about it by only exercising half their body (the upper half). But you do need to preserve lean mass in your lower body, and as research shows, aerobic exercise doesn't do this. So strengthen your lower body; after all, it has the largest muscles in your body and can burn a whole lotta calories. Trust me, you can do this without getting huge legs which will weigh you down in climbing. Oh, and your knees will thank you for it eventually.

7. Yes, you MUST watch what you eat. BUT overly restrictive "dieting" can have very negative effects on your resting metabolic rate (i.e. it will decline), effects which studies show not even cardio or weight training will be able to reverse back up.

8. Do not deny yourself things completely. I have never told a client they cannot have this or that. Just areas where they need to cut back and/or employ other strategies. If you pig out one day, make sure you rein in the following two days to make up for it or do some extra exercise to help get into a calorie deficit. Also, avoid drinking your calories!

9. Accept that your problem areas will always be your problem areas, no matter how perfect your body eventually becomes on my advice. This is true for every person on earth. The battle will be eternal, and it will always be in the same place(s).

10. Lastly, most of rtwilli4's post was completely useless and/or nonsense. Please avoid reading it if you haven't already.

Sorry this was so long. This kind of stuff can't fit into a three-sentence post. Hope it helps a little!

quoted the whole thing because it was worth repeating. thank you aerili for posting up. pretty much everything else in this thread is a load of shit. i just didn't want to have to write a post since 1) i don't want to write that much and 2) don't have anywhere near the qualifications of aerili. anyway, listen to her.


jaablink


Nov 25, 2008, 3:44 PM
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You could try Bikram Yoga (Hot Yoga). The temp in the studio is a humid 110ish.


limeydave


Nov 25, 2008, 4:02 PM
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I'm roughly the same height and was the same weight as the OP - 5'11" and 190lbs.

I figured out by BMR is around 1700 calories and restricted my intake to 2000 / day.

This allowed me to eat cheesburgers and drink Guinness pretty much when I wanted (up to 2000Kcal/day) and I climbed 3-5 days a week.

You hit plateaus on the way down as fat is replaced by muscle, and after about 3 months I was able to give up the calorie watching.

Right now I am 160 and still getting stronger - my % fat has gone from 20+% to ~10%.

Just burn more than you put in and the good news is that if you love to climb, you already have the lifesytle change that most people find so hard to make.

Also warm up before climbing hard - you'll avoid the flash pump.

Good luck.


jt512


Nov 25, 2008, 5:44 PM
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This thread has become unbearably painful to read. Please see How to Lose Weight to Improve Your Climbing.

The same article is normally available from my web site as a pdf file; however, my web site is temporarily offline.

Jay


(This post was edited by jt512 on Nov 25, 2008, 5:53 PM)


Toast_in_the_Machine


Dec 3, 2008, 1:43 PM
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aerili wrote:
WTF. Why do I hear all this shit about doing Pilates for your gut, doing swimming instead of some other aerobic exercise b/c it will "work your core [aka beer gut] more", and all other manner of core-specific workouts?

Do you guys honestly still believe in spot reduction???

Rule #1: don't give advice on weight loss when you have no idea what you are talking about--and when, in fact, you still subscribe to pseudoscience of years gone by.

Except that I read somewhere about one kind of spot reduction. It was about how the combination of spanking, arousal, and adult exercise reduced the size of a woman’s backside.

Not really a parallel with a guy’s gut, but…

I’ll see if I can find that article….


pataphysicien


Dec 7, 2008, 1:38 PM
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thanks to aerili for the usual bit of sense in these threads.

aerili wrote:
7. Which leads to my next point. Climber dudes who need to lose weight tend to try to go about it by only exercising half their body (the upper half). But you do need to preserve lean mass in your lower body, and as research shows, aerobic exercise doesn't do this. So strengthen your lower body; after all, it has the largest muscles in your body and can burn a whole lotta calories. Trust me, you can do this without getting huge legs which will weigh you down in climbing. Oh, and your knees will thank you for it eventually.

I have been thinking about this. I climb and strengthen my upper body incl. antagonists. on off-days I've been doing 10k aerobic runs, 3 times a week. fitness-wise this works great, I used to run much more than this. so no feeling of overtraining.

but recently I've had some discomfort on the inside of my right knee. I suspect it actually comes from climbing and not running, however as I do both it's really hard to tell. I do substitute some cycling here and there and after reading into it recently I'll try to fit in one or two HIIT sessions on the bike, as I want to go down some more in body fat.

now my question to you is: what kind of strength training for the legs would you recommend? of course I don't want to bulk, but it would be great to a) burn some more calories down there and b) to help stabilize the knee more.

thanks a lot for your efforts here Smile


(This post was edited by pataphysicien on Dec 7, 2008, 2:04 PM)

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